Macs

[Rainbow Dash]

A lot of people here don't seem to like Macs. I'm wondering, why? A lot of people say they're too expensive but a lot of the software you can buy for Macs are much cheaper than Windows (like I pay for much software but that's a different argument )

I understand that in some ways Windows is better than Macs (especially if you play a lot of games) but I think they both have their pros and cons.

Windows genuinely pisses me off. I find it awkward to use. I know HOW to use Windows fairly well but I don't like the way it works. Mac OS X is just easier imo, a lot less seems to go wrong. I've had my iMac for nearly a year and I've had one problem. I would sometimes get a kernel panic because of my time machine external hard-drive, I googled what was happening and I fixed it straight away. If there's a problem with a Mac it's easier to fix because the chances of someone else having the same problem is quite high.

So, what's with all the Mac hate?

[David]

Most people just hate the Apple "cult".

[Illuminate]

I personally LOVE Apple iMacs. They are one a whole new level when it comes to technology. I think people hate them because Windows has been around for so long and also Apple is really expensive. It's as if you're paying more for the logo on the product than the product itself.

[Loving Linux Penguin]

Apple's computers do tend to be a little more expensive than other brands, but you also have to realize that they include software that would normally cost you $180 to buy PLUS the current version of Mac OS X. I also think that it's worth it, at least for certain people, because you're buying a premium experience--you have software and hardware serviceable by one company, not 2 or 3. To me it makes a fair amount of sense. I personally am a fan of Apple products (although my love is beginning to decline as Apple makes some ridiculous changes to Mac OS X) and share your dread of Windows. I can use just about any user interface (except perhaps DOS) that you put in front of me. Will I enjoy it? Probably not.

[Cosmo]

I love my Mac. I would never switch although I find it useful to have a separate partition for Windows for my Visual Novels etc.

[Revolution]

There are pros and cons on each. Gaming is better on PCs generally, and for Graphic/Music stuff, Macs are better. I'm a complete PC person, I don't understand macs, that's just a personal preference. My boyfriend uses a mac, and although they're not for me, it's a very nice computer. PCs are cheaper, and last longer as well, Macs are kinda flimsy, they don't last as long in my experience of seeing others with them, the laptops are thinner and break a bit easier, but at the same time, they freeze and stuff less. I don't know. It's all personal preference, I like PCs, but don't hate Macs. I just make fun of my boyfriend's because it's fun to call him a hipster. I really have nothing against them.

[Squidgy]

I hate macs. I've had windows for so long thats what I'm used to using. The iMac confuses me :P I tried to use my friends and ended up turning it off in frustration.

[Loving Linux Penguin]

Originally Posted by Squidgy

I hate macs. I've had windows for so long thats what I'm used to using. The iMac confuses me :P I tried to use my friends and ended up turning it off in frustration.

Lol it's not difficult. In fact I'd say it's more user friendly and intuitive than Windows is...

[Squidgy]

Originally Posted by Loving Linux Penguin

Lol it's not difficult. In fact I'd say it's more user friendly and intuitive than Windows is...

I may be a a little impatient I just find a huge difference in the two systems and Mac isn't what I'm used to, I like my computer how it is. Too much change. Haha I must sound like an old lady

[TheCrowing]

I personally don't like Macs much for what I do. Unless you're running Windows on your Mac, I find them almost useless (for me, just a reminder). They're great for creative projects and browsing, but other than that, I don't enjoy it much. As an engineering student, all of the programs that we use for our classes only run on windows set-ups. A few kids have macs, but they're still running windows. And Macs are also not too good for gaming.
Honestly, Macs are good because they're less likely to pick up viruses in general, and the layout is a bit more simple and efficient. They're good computers, just not what I need for what I do.

[Loving Linux Penguin]

^ And that is a perfectly valid statement. Just like Windows isn't good for all of what I do.

[Digilodger]

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

I understand that in some ways Windows is better than Macs (especially if you play a lot of games) but I think they both have their pros and cons.

Exactly! Both have pros and cons. For those who are richer, they have the choice of going for Macs. For us poorer people, we have to stick with some affordable. Also, as mentioned by the posters above, sometimes it's just one is better for what we want to do.

For me, the main reason why I don't like or use Macs is because of their prices. Now, Macs certainly are nice. If I have the money, then I would definitely buy them, but seriously, their prices are ridiculously high!

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

A lot of people say they're too expensive but a lot of the software you can buy for Macs are much cheaper than Windows (like I pay for much software but that's a different argument )

Let's compare a current Macbook Pro's price vs. an Asus Notebook's price:

Specs of a Macbook Pro That Costs About $1,799.00 (or About $1,499.00, if Refurbished):
Intel Core i7 2.2GHz, 4GB DDR3, 500GB HDD
Intel HD Graphics 3000 and AMD Radeon HD 6750M with 512MB GDDR5
15.4" display, 7-hour battery

Specs of a Asus Notebook That Costs About $1,299.99 (or About $799.99 USD, if on Sale or Refurbished):
Intel Core i7 2.0GHz, 8GB DDR3, 750GB HDD
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460M
17.3" display, 8-cell lithium ion (which should last 6 to 8 hours)

The two specs are similar, but take a look at the prices. That's about $1800 vs. $1300 and $1500 vs. $800. Would you like me to give some comparison with the Macbook Air, too?

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

a lot of the software you can buy for Macs are much cheaper than Windows (like I pay for much software but that's a different argument )

Well, for one, the few hundreds dollars (or several hundred dollars) that I've saved by going for a Windows laptop can go straight toward the software.

But where did you get that softwares for Macs are cheaper anyway?

For most people, only ONE software suite is necessary to buy: Microsoft Office Suite. Now, of course, depending on your jobs, you might need other specific software, such as Adobe Creative Suite or Quickbook. But once again, for the average person, MS Office suite is all they need. The price is the same for both the Mac and Windows versions. Photoshop's prices are also the same. Of course, you would be able to find discounts for Macs if you look around, but the same applies for Windows.


Availability of Free Software

Windows has many software available for free. Many of which are about as good as the commercial ones.

• LibreOffice continues after the (unofficial) death of OpenOffice. It's a great replacement for Microsoft Office suite.

• For advanced image editor, we have GIMP (doesn't have as many features as Photoshop, but still comparable to Photoshop, some people actually prefer it over Photoshop). For those who finds GIMP too complex and dislike to learn, we have Paint.NET (NOT Paint, I mean Paint.NET). Even simpler image editor is Photoscape.

• And for advanced video editor, we have Lightworks; it was good enough to be used professionally in the making of movies like Pulp Fiction, The Departed, Centurion and Shutter Island. For those who dislike to spend too much learning non-linear editing, we have a simpler video editor name Avidemux.

For me, personally, all I've spent on software my Windows computers are Microsoft Office Suite for about $100 (student discount), and Adobe Photoshop for about $200 (student discount AND holiday sale, WITHOUT the sale, it's about $300). That's about $300 total. I would still spent less money than going for a Mac.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

Windows genuinely pisses me off. I find it awkward to use. I know HOW to use Windows fairly well but I don't like the way it works. Mac OS X is just easier imo, a lot less seems to go wrong. I've had my iMac for nearly a year and I've had one problem. I would sometimes get a kernel panic because of my time machine external hard-drive, I googled what was happening and I fixed it straight away. If there's a problem with a Mac it's easier to fix because the chances of someone else having the same problem is quite high.

Like you've said before, both have pros and cons; it's a matter of opinion--and what we're already used to. You may feel awkward with Windows and completely clueless on Linux, but I'm comfortable with both Windows (XP to 7) and Linux Ubuntu (9.04 to 11.10). I have only Macs at my school so I don't have a concrete opinion on them yet.

Part of the reasons why Windows seem to have many more problem is because more people are using Windows. This automatically means that the number of people encountering problems are also more.

This is also true with the availability of malware (virus, spyware, trojan, keylogger, etc.) for Windows vs. for Macs. It's not that Macs are more secure; it's just that since 90% of the market uses Windows, developing malware for Windows gives more "bang for the bucks."


Also, Windows has a larger user base. That means the chances of someone else having the same problem as yours are also high.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

So, what's with all the Mac hate?

So what's with all the Windows hate? I think we all agree that both have their pros and cons.

[Cosmo]

I think the main reason I like Macs is beacause the software available is just downright objectively higher quality. No there's not as much, but what is there is designed 10000x better, is far more stable, easier to manage and update and less 'dodgy'.

Oh and the font rendering is 100000000x nicer ;D

[Rainbow Dash]

Like if you want to buy Microsoft Office for Windows it's nearly £90

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Of...6044538&sr=1-1

and iWork is only £60

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Apple-MB942Z...6044589&sr=1-1

Pixelmator is also only £20.99

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pixel...104?mt=12&ls=1

The alternatives just seem to be cheaper. Sure Pixelmator isn't quite as good as Photoshop but you can still do a LOT with it.

I still use Windows in college (for some annoying reason they still use XP -____-)

[Shawn K.]

My family dumped windows based computers and switched to Apple products for one main reason; Our Mac Pro, iMacs, MacBooks, iPads, iPhones, and iPod Touchs', ALL WORK, ALL THE TIME.

No blue screens, no security alerts, no peripheral incompatibility, no failed updates, and no need to buy a whole new computer every couple of years because the hardware is not forward compatible with the new OS, or the new OS is not backward compatible with some hardware or software.

For those things that we need Windows software capability we have Mac versions of the software, like Office for Mac. We have more issues with the two or three Windows software packages than with all the other Mac software and Apps combined.

I'm only in high school, and granted I use the computing aspects of these systems for more media and creative purposes, but I haven't run into any limitations at home or at school. .

My home studio runs on a MacBook using Logic Pro, and I can take ideas I'm messing around with on my iPad in GarageBand, and work on them in Logic Pro.

The recording studio at school is run on a Mac. The video production studios are run by Mac. The Web Design, Robotics, Graphic Arts, and Photography labs are all run by Macs.

I'm hooked on Mac for life.

[Rainbow Dash]

Another thing is if you buy a HP/Acer/Sony laptop/computer they're full of crapware. There are tutorials all over the web explaining how to delete them. I shouldn't need to do all that :|

http://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Crapwa...ndows-Computer

The only things that really comes pre-installed on a Mac are things most people need (TextEdit for example) or want (like the iLife suite) There's no free-trial bullocks.

[Digilodger]

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

Like if you want to buy Microsoft Office for Windows it's nearly £90

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Of...6044538&sr=1-1

and iWork is only £60

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Apple-MB942Z...6044589&sr=1-1

Pixelmator is also only £20.99

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pixel...104?mt=12&ls=1

The alternatives just seem to be cheaper. Sure Pixelmator isn't quite as good as Photoshop but you can still do a LOT with it.

I still use Windows in college (for some annoying reason they still use XP -____-)

You're comparing two different products. Obviously the prices are going to be different. If that's the game you want to play, then how about this:

iWorks vs. LibreOffice: LibreOffice is free, also available for Macs, by the way.
Pixelmator vs. GIMP: GIMP is free and about as powerful as Photoshop. (If Photoshop is 100, then GIMP is about 85.) Also available for Macs.

It's hard to get much cheaper than free . And as you can see, software for Mac and Windows tend to have same price.

Of course, as far as office suites and image editors go, Microsoft Office and Adobe Photoshop are the industry standard. Putting Pixelmator or GIMP on your resume is meaningless, especially Pixelmator.

==============================

Once again, as said in my previous post, Macs are definitely nicer computers overall. Given the money, I would buy a Mac. But Windows laptops definitely beat them when it comes to price.


My current laptop was bought about 2 years ago, for about $380 USD (student discount plus on sale ). Here is its specs:

Intel Core i3 2.13GHz (quad-core), 4GB DDR3, 320GB HDD
Intel HD Graphics
15.6" display, 6-cell lithium ion (which should last 3 to 4 hours)

This is plenty enough for everyday usage, office suites, light gaming, image editing (with Adobe Illustrator, Photoshop, and GIMP) and light video editing. Without any lag!


Also I should mention that I've never run into any problem with it yet, except that the battery now only lasts about 2 hours and 50 minutes, rather than about 3 hours and 20 minutes like before.


The cheapest Macbook Air is about $1000 USD, or about $800, if refurbished. That's still $800 vs. $380 . For $800, I can buy a computer comparable to a Macbook Pro, complete with Intel Core i7, 8GB DDR3, 750GB HDD, 17" display, etc.

Originally Posted by Rainbow Dash

Another thing is if you buy a HP/Acer/Sony laptop/computer they're full of crapware. There are tutorials all over the web explaining how to delete them. I shouldn't need to do all that :|

http://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Crapwa...ndows-Computer

The only things that really comes pre-installed on a Mac are things most people need (TextEdit for example) or want (like the iLife suite) There's no free-trial bullocks.

That's because Apple distribute their own computers and you buy them from official Apple stores.


If you buy your computers from the official Microsoft store, then you won't see any crapware/bloatware on your Windows computer, too. Here's the link.

[Rainbow Dash]

Yeah, I suppose that is true. Most things I just seem to want for Mac are genuinely cheaper

I've actually never bought a PC from the official Microsoft Store. I just buy stuff from Comet as my friend works there so I get discounts

[Maverick.]

Because they cost money, money, money. PC's really don't. Other than that, macs are really nice computers. They are faster, images look better on them, and they are less prone to viruses.

[Rainbow Dash]

I've actually given up even having an anti-virus app on my Mac. The more I researched the more I realised how pointless Mac anti-viruses really are :/

[Loving Linux Penguin]

I should point out though that the only reason they're less prone is that nobody really writes Malware targeted toward them. Mac OS X is NOT immune from viruses, and there WILL come a time when we'll have to be just as wary as Windows users.

[Rainbow Dash]

Oh yeah. No OS is immune to viruses but since Macs aren't the biggest OS's in the market nobody is really bothering to write Mac viruses. The only one I've come across in a year was this trojan/malware:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTgLIl-CcbU

which did pop up for me whilst google image searching but I knew it was a rouge straight away so didn't install it because I have common sense.

[how.we.operate.]

Alright this will be a very long post.
I've been a Mac user all my life and so has my family...BUT I have worked with PCs, I do have Windows 7 on my Mac, and I know way too many PC users that hate on Macs. Let me explain some things...

First off, if you are a Windows user, of course you will hate Apple for the cost of their products. I do too. It doesn't mean hate on Apple.
Also, if you are a Windows user, it takes time to adjust to using a Mac. For example, my boyfriend and my roommates are both PC users. When my boyfriend started to try to use my laptop to do simple things like check Facebook, he got very frustrated due to the keyboard layout/differences. Yes it is slightly different...this just means it takes some time to remember that the Command/Apple key is like the Control key. Next is the lack of right click which can be tackled by using the trackpad or holding the Control key. There are many tiny problems that people get frustrated with and decide they don't like it. Honestly, all you have to do is learn to use it...I mean how frustrating is using Facebook when they do a stupid update? It just takes time to learn how to use it.
My roommate...so I am a computer science major and he is a network security major...yesterday we were trying to Bootcamp our other roommate's Mac BUT with Windows, you have to download a separate program to do all these specific things to burn the disc image and you can't transfer the disc image to a flash drive. He ended up getting too frustrated with Windows to bother burning the disc. Meanwhile, Macs have preinstalled software that guides you through the process of burning the disc image (for those of you that don't know, this is completely different from burning a regular CD).
I worked at a high school's computer lab where they Bootcamped all their iMacs to have Windows 7 on it. I helped the students use these computer and you know what the biggest complaint was while they used 7 on a Mac? That they couldn't copy, paste, etc when in reality, the Control key now is the control key and the Apple/Command key becomes the Windows key. Simple things that you won't know until you look.

I also worked with IT guys in a school district that used all Macs - Macbooks, iMacs, iTouches, iPads, Macbook Pros, Mac Minis, and more. These guys explained how certain tiny bits of the Mac work together or about certain features on the Macs and why they are there. For example, Mac has the feature of if you run out of battery, the computer will "shut off" until you charge it for a bit (usually a few minutes). After the computer starts back up, it goes back to what you were doing AS IF NOTHING HAPPENED. This idea is genius.
With the newest OS, Lion, gestures now are dominant. You can use the trackpad to do so much--switch screens (you can have multiple "Desktop" screens and switch between them), switch applications, zoom, rotate, go back/forward a page, show what windows you have open, go to the applications folder, and much more.
Did you know that with the PDF viewer, Preview, you can now insert your signature by means of your webcam? This is a feature added where you simply save/store your signature to be put in a PDF.

Now for the gamers out there, yes PCs tend to have some advantages with gaming. Honestly, it depends on the game and the tech specs of your computer. For example, getting a basic MacBook Air is not an ideal gaming machine just like having a crappy PC laptop isn't a gaming laptop. My parents just got a new iMac and it plays games wonderfully and my laptop (3 year old MacBook Pro) is a pretty great gaming machine but not the best. Then a PC built for gaming, of course is going to be fantastic whereas a laptop with decent tech specs will not run well-my boyfriend has a laptop that refuses to run Minecraft in offline mode.

My personal opinion, I prefer Macs of course. This is my 3rd laptop from Apple-the first got destroyed, the 2nd (now about 5+years old) is being used by my family and it still runs great, and my current laptop which is almost 3 years old. I have had little issue with any of them and if I had, they are easy to fix issues.
Another HUGE Apple plus is the customer service (or at least in my experience). AppleCare/the warranty is a great thing-once they replaced my CD drive and Hard drive for free.
Overall, I feel like Macs are must easier to use IF you get to know how to use them. My mom uses my old laptop, but for work she uses a PC. She has now had to take her PC multiple times due to random errors whereas my laptop has not had any issues.

Software-Mac has software preinstalled that is a very good basic tool for users. By this I mean if you want to edit video clips, iMovie has many tools that users will need but it probably isn't what a professional would use. Meanwhile, you have to find a PC version that does what you want. From what I've seen, you tend to get PC software that is meant for a very specific type of editing instead of in general.

Viruses-Macs can get viruses. The issue has been that Mac has a much smaller user base in comparison to PCs, therefore who would want to target the small group? PCs have come pretty far, but there are still so many viruses-my boyfriend kept getting a virus on one of his PCs even with anti-virus software. In my lifetime, I have not seen a Mac virus.

The main Mac hate that I see is from PC users that don't take the time to learn how to use Macs. For example, I know a gamer who simply hated Macs...because he couldn't get something to work. After teaching my boyfriend how to do little things, he now tolerates Macs. I've converted many to Macs from PCs and they love Macs after you teach them how to use it. My opinion is that you need to have some help-either tutorials or face to face help etc-so that you understand how to use a Mac. Use it, learn it, then you can criticize it.

[Darkeinu ♥]

I love my macbook. It's my friend.

[Rainbow Dash]

I know this is a bit selfish but in a way I like the fact my dad and sister don't know how to use my Mac. They were on my old laptop all the time and they don't even touch this because they can't be arsed to learn how to use it

When I first used a Mac (in college, back when I was doing art) it did confuse me a little but that's because I was so used to the half-arsed Windows OS.

If I had a child I think I would prefer them to use a Mac than Windows. The parental controls are easier to use and there's a lot less for them to fuck up.