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Thumbs down Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 04:13 AM

I do not judge character. But I have a strong opinion on Homosexuality: it's not natural; its a choice. Every species that need two two reproduce have one Male and one Female. That is how God intended everything to be. Homosexuality has been debunked to a decision to give into sexual attraction of another of the same sex. This is a urge. It is a choice whether or not you accept to follow this sin or not. Now adays we have to be accomodading. I think this is ridiculous. You trick your mind after you give into the false urges that desire and are turned off of the opposite of normal funtioning people. I had a few friends that were "gay" but after they grew up a while they decided to be straight. I don't hate people, I just disagree with one's choices.
   
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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 06:15 AM

Okay. It's obvious you are doing this for attention, but I'm still going to respond in a dignified way because I occasionally like a good arguement.

Also, I think when your opinion infringes on the rights of others, I have a right to hate it, but I don't hate YOU (as that would be hypocritical)
Ask any doctor and they will say homosexuality is not a choice, here is some research, which I easily found with a simple google search:
1. http://www.livescience.com/50058-bei...-a-choice.html
2. http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/gay-gene-di...choice-1436389
3. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steve-...b_5805680.html
4. http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...oice/?page=all
5. http://m.health24.com/health24/Sex/S...hoice-20150807
6. http://www.newsweek.com/2015/05/15/g...ty-328285.html
7. http://time.com/3733480/ben-carson-gay-choice-science/
There is not enough proof that there is a "gay gene", but science twists unanimously agree being gay is not a choice-whether you were born this way or comes through puberty, it is not a choice.

Our bodies were not designed for homosexual sex-you're right on that, but have you thought about the possible evolutionary need for gay people? With overpopulation becoming a bigger problem, it makes sense that a certain group would evolve to not have the desire to reproduce, by having attraction for the same sex? It's all theoretical but it makes sense.

About your friends identifying as gay then becoming straight-that's not possible. Unless they were never gay, or only told you they were straight just so there would be no judgement from your side of the friendship? I also want proof that these people even existed and you didn't make them up to prove a point.

Finally, does God hate gays?
OF COURSE NOT. The Bible, particularly in the New Testament preaches love ("God is Love", Jesus never preached against homosexuality-and MAYBE even helped someone who identified as gay without changing their sexuality-look it up), so God doesn't hate anybody, especially for being gay.

But is it a sin? Still no.
First of all, if you are born gay, as I have proved, and God made you and has a plan for you, then God made you gay. That simple.
But what about the Bible verses that flat out say homosexuality is a sin? Well...those are either mistranslations or misconceptions.
I recommend:
1. http://www.religioustolerance.org/ashford01.htm
2. http://www.notalllikethat.org/taking...homosexuality/
3. https://moanti.wordpress.com/2012/02...-is-not-a-sin/
4. http://www.gaychristian101.com/why-d...not-a-sin.html
5. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rev-su...b_1569846.html
6. http://coolingtwilight.com/why-homos...ty-isnt-a-sin/
And even if they weren't all misconceptions, the passages in Leviticus for example, don't apply anymore (as said in Galatians somewhere-they only applied to ancient Jews and Isarelites). The Bible verses can also be interpreted as considering not following your sexual orientation as a sin, not homosexuality itself.

I hope I at least enlightened you to the other side, and I encourage you to go in with an open mind. If you are set in your ways, this won't change a thing, and I'm certainly not going to force you to believe in anything, but I mean consider the evidence and common sense-and finally, don't go sharing an opinion just to get attention (like Trump).

Also, think: if it is a choice, how come gay people can get aroused for gay sex but not for straight sex or seeing a member of the opposite sex naked?

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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 06:20 AM

I have gone ahead and moved this to current events and debates. I feel like it fits better here. If you disagree feel free to message me.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 08:23 AM

Well, I don't agree with basing one's opinions on the presumed existence of an imaginary friend and the life of a lad from the late Iron Age who's his own father and was nailed to a cross, but you don't see me complaining or calling your behaviour unnatural. Live and let live, and maybe try to develop some critical thinking skills too.
   
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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 12:12 PM

Everything we have the ability to do is a product of evolution. Part of evolution is this flexibility in one's sexuality and the gender fluidity. Just like some people have blond hair and some people have brown hair. Both are perfectly natural. Sometimes a person with born with brown hair starts getting darker hair after puberty. That's natural too. (Assuming it wasn't dyed xD) Then again even if it weren't "natural" is anything in this world truly natural anymore? The food we eat had been selectively breeded, we use digital and electronic devices, we take buses and trains for transportation. We read and write...that's not NATURAL
But then again, it kind of is to us humans. We were evolved this way. We can't camaflauge because that's not natural to us. See, if it were natural then we could do it.

And honestly, I don't care if it is not natural, a choice or whatever else. Unnatural or choices does not equate to bad, sin, or evil. Or anything else. It isn't violent or abusive. At least not inherently so.

And just to put it out there ancient Greeks (we are talking BC era) has a tale about how humans have to find their other half because Zeus split the human body that used to have double of everything. It was said that 1/3 were female and male, 1/3 female and female and 1/3 male and male. Anyway, I'm not saying I believe in Zeus or Greek mythology as literal. But it does talk about homosexuality from an ancient time and that just shows it isn't the latest fashion choice but it is something real...at least to many people it is.
   
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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 04:29 PM

While I wholeheartedly respect your thoughts and opinions on homosexuality, I'm afraid I'm going to have to call you out on your statement saying that 'Homosexuality has been debunked to give into sexual attraction' and request that you provide non-religious, pure scientific sources of information to back up your claims.

I however, can provide you with non-religious, purely scientific information on the fact that humans are not the only living creatures on this earth to 'practice' homosexuality. http://www.bbc.co.uk/earth/story/201...sexual-animals (PG-13 on the link of course) It has been proven that several other types of animals including insects such as wasps for example, engage in homosexual activities, so my question to you is, are they all sinners too?


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 06:21 PM

if you didn't want people to hate/disagree with your opinion, you might not have wanted to post it on a forum where 90% of the users aren't completely straight.

there are some things i'd like to address in your argument, not because i want to "prove you wrong" or anything.. everyone is entitled to their own opinion. however, i do want to point out a few things, because believe it or not, i used to think exactly like you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessOne View Post
I do not judge character. But I have a strong opinion on Homosexuality: it's not natural; its a choice.
okay. so i used to consider myself the straightest person in the world. i didn't even think about being with a girl, simply because it had been shoved down my throat for so long that homosexuality isn't okay and that it's pretty much a one-way ticket to hell.
but, to my horror at the time, i began to have feelings for one of my closest friends, who happened to be a girl.
after that, i slowly found myself checking other girls out in public, having more female celebrity crushes than male, and actually being able to picture myself with another girl.
i definitely wouldn't marry one, and i do still like males a LOT more, but i can't deny that i've had feelings for girls as well.

and that is not something that i would ever choose. trust me. i was raised as the most religious, conservative, sheltered kid alive.

the way i see it, i never chose to feel this way. i simply chose to address those feelings (because i had been blocking them out for so long), and i think that's where the confusion of "choosing to be this way" comes from.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessOne View Post
Every species that need two two reproduce have one Male and one Female. That is how God intended everything to be. Homosexuality has been debunked to a decision to give into sexual attraction of another of the same sex. This is a urge. It is a choice whether or not you accept to follow this sin or not. Now *a days we have to be *accommodating.
there are multiple articles out there stating ways that animals participate in homosexual behavior.
http://www.gaystarnews.com/article/s...14/#gs.8XSEnUI
and lets just say that it wasn't natural. that it was a complete choice and that it really was the way "god intended it to be."
we are SO overpopulated it's not even funny. there are boatloads of kids in foster care and adoption centers with NO family whatsoever. so, if a gay couple can adopt a child (or more!!), that's killing two pretty big birds with one stone and therefore i don't see a problem with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessOne View Post
I think this is ridiculous. You trick your mind after you give into the false urges that desire and are turned off of the opposite of normal *functioning people. I had a few friends that were "gay" but after they grew up a while they decided to be straight. I don't hate people, I just disagree with one's choices.
nobody tricks their mind into thinking anything about what/who they prefer romantically and sexually. it would be as hard for a straight person to pretend they're attracted to the same sex as it is for a gay person to pretend that they're straight -- which DOES happen, because of the ridiculous societal and religious pressure to be so-called "normal functioning people". (could you humor me please and just define a "normal functioning human"? are humans not meant to love one another? is that not normal??)

and a lot of people question their sexuality during their teen years. a lot. it's an extremely hormonal time of so many changes in such a small period of time that it makes us consider things and try to figure out who we are.
and i'm not gonna lie, sometimes homosexuality is a phase. sometimes it's just experimentation.
but that doesn't make other people, who are gay their entire lives, any less valid.

honestly, if it's not hurting anyone... who cares?? just let people be happy.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 07:09 PM

People can't help how they feel. They don't have control of that.

Have you ever woken up one day, gotten out of bed, stretched, and said, "Gee, I think I'm going to choose to get the flu today." Or, "You know, I think I'm going to be depressed and have panic attacks all day long."

No one wakes up and decides to be attracted to the same sex. It's not a decision, it just happens.

People can't control how they feel but they can choose how they react to their feelings.

Someone with the flu might have some chicken noodle soup and get some extra sleep. Someone with depression might look into antidepressants or find a therapist. Or, they might suffer in silence if they can't get help. Someone coming to terms with their sexuality might be open about it, or some might be silent for fear of judgement. People do what they're comfortable with in their current environment.

Some people develop depression before they even know the actual term. I know I had it before I knew what it even was. Likewise, some realize they have feelings for the same sex before they know what the word homosexual means. Maybe not as often now, since people are becoming more open about it. But what about a few years or decades ago? How can someone choose to be homosexual if they don't even know what it is?


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 07:12 PM

Actually, I do hate your opinion. I respect you as a person, but you cannot tell people to not hate your opinion especially when your opinion is harmful to their existence. You also can't hide behind an uneducated thought and defend it only that it is "your opinion." You had some friends who grew up to be straight? Anecdotal stories are not evidence, and your friends could have fluid sexuality or are now closeted. So, no.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 6th 2016, 09:26 PM

Even if it were a choice... it would be their choice and would harm no one. Provided the % of homosexual persons in the population would remain relatively low. Obviously, populations need to be able to reproduce effectively to survive.

Like someone else here said already, probably every human trait which exists today, is a product of evolution, and is therefore "natural". What you could call "unnatural", would be traits humans have adopted under the influence of our man-made environment, and by this I mean things like the whole digital age, computers, media, fast transport, globalization, etc.

I want to make an analogy here. I hope I'm not misunderstood by some people though (read to the end before judging): CANCER

Cases of cancer were much lower in the past, but it would happen. It was "natural". Same way certain birth defects are "natural", and some are not. However, due to countless man-made environmental influences such as fast foods, radiation, pollution, cases of cancer have increased greatly. This is not "natural". What I am saying, is that these things are far more complex than simply saying it "is or isn't natural".

There are theories that the frequency of homosexuality has increased. I don't know enough about this to comment much, but it wouldn't surprise me. I know for a fact, that it is effectively impossible to tell what % of the population was homosexual in the past... because who the fk would volunteer such information? And risk getting beaten up or thrown in prison? I am almost certain that there are environmental factors which influence whether or not someone becomes homosexual. Some of those environmental factors may be attributed to our modern lifestyles... ergo, you could argue that it is "unnatural". Though like I said, I know little about the "science" behind homosexuality and what causes it. It just never played a large enough part in my life for me to set that kind of time aside for it and learn about it specifically.

It is also "unnatural" to wear clothes, use mobile phones, etc. None of those things harm anyone in any notable ways. Homosexuality is most like partially natural, and partially unnatural. But it harms no one (provided it's % remains relatively low). On the other hand... cancer, natural or not, does harm people, and is far more worthy of attention.

Ironically, you could even argue that religion is unnatural, because much of it is "man-made" in a certain sense. Don't take this the wrong way. I'm not calling you out on your beliefs. Just think about it rationally though. Even if God exists, then all the Churches, religious leaders, priests, bishops, and other positions of authority, are man-made. Even the bible is written by people and passed down through generations. All those things are man-made, and arguably, unnatural. Whether it is harmful or not though depends on the people in charge (which I have been saying for a long time now).

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Then politics doesn't care about you either. Truth. You've got to make your voice heard, if you want to be listened to. But that's too logical for some people, so let me go a step further. Not making your voice heard, leaves other people free to hijack it by speaking on your behalf, even if they don't actually give a shit about you. That's politics. So, make your voice heard. That's not a quote from anywhere. That's just me.


   
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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 7th 2016, 03:28 AM

I wanted to respond earlier but was busy.

Homosexuality is not unnatural. I mean, just take for example the animals in the animal kingdom that display homosexuality. If it was unnatural and sex/relationships were only supposed to be between men and women I don't think Animals would display it. Humans are more advanced in that we can think and reason and love (I still think animals can too). But, we are, animals and those sexual desires and urges are going to be the same across the board.

I think there are a lot of things that could explain homosexuality but none of these things include it being unnatural.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 9th 2016, 02:48 AM

Perhaps if you want to be "hated" less, you ought to provide more compelling reasons for your views than "it's a choice". As far as it's "debuked status" - I have no idea where you're getting that idea (probably some Christian fundamentalist propoganda), but the leading explanations all lean toward epigenetics. This means that people in fact have no choice whatsoever, and the notion that they ought to repress their sexuality is deeply damaging to the individual and those that invoke it are very much propogating social ills.
If you're telling someone that a deeply held characteristic of theirs is inherently wrong and their repressing it is the only manner in which they won't burn for eternity, I don't know how much love you ought to expect in response.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 9th 2016, 03:12 AM

Nah, it's fine. You are perfectly entitled to your wrong opinion.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 9th 2016, 03:50 AM

Okay, just going to make this clear. I don't hate you, but yes I absolutely hate your opinion. The amount of people that hold this opinion astounds me and if it is something so hurtful to a life, then yes I am going to hate it. There is no evidence it is unnatural, in fact there is heaps of evidence that it is natural and that you are either born that way or it develops through puberty. But in no way is it 'unnatural'. Seriously, if you want sources, look at JustMeUnfortunately's post with the sources at the bottom. You can't miss it. I'm serious, read them. They are quite interesting, especially since he was kind enough to even link Christian sites as well for you to read. Now obviously you got your opinion from some Christian place, or someone else has told you that's the way it is, and I get that people actually believe that point of view. I know my church absolutely believes it and even though they insist that they are not homophobic, they also insist that being gay is like murder and rape, which I personally do not believe. One is killing people and sexually violating people leaving them either dead or traumatised for the rest of their life, the other is just a person who is attracted to the same sex.

One thing I want to get out of the way, I know a lot of people believe that homosexuality is the actual act of sex with two guys or girls, for some weird reason, and it actually is not, it's sexual attraction. So if you are referring to the actual act (which is also fine as well by the way, I may be asexual but I still think that you can have sex with who you like) then that would suck but trust me, homosexuality is just attraction and nothing else. Of course that can lead to sex but it's not exclusively sex.

Now I promised myself I would rant and I'm really trying, but bear with me here because you have a hurtful opinion and that not only affects yourself, but also other people. So I'm just giving my two cents in this.

There are so many other things that are also classified as 'unnatural', like eating shellfish and mixing fabrics, yet why does no one ever comment about that? Those aren't enforced for whatever reason but people go straight for the verse about homosexuality, which actually isn't about it but anyway, and go on about how that's the one you should pay attention to. I never understood that but anyway. There are also plenty of animals that engage in homosexual activities, yet no seems to notice they are doing it as well. If it is so 'unnatural', why do they do it as well? Doesn't that make it just a basic thing that all creatures do? Another thing, divorce. It is mentioned many times in the bible about being wrong, it even says that you should stone the women to death for having a divorce. To be honest, it is more blatantly clear about divorce and how wrong it is than homosexuality. The thing is though, people still get divorced. If you went and stoned people for getting them then I'm sure you would lose half the population seeing as 49% (approximately) of different sex couples get divorced. Divorce may not be wanted, but no one looks down on the couple for having one and no one tries to kill them, reject them, change them, abuse them, or even deny them the right to another marriage. So how come something that is no even directly stated is seen as sin and should definitely be avoided, even have a go at trying to 'make them straight' if you really want to, but something that is blatantly stated many times, even more times than homosexuality, that is not seen as sin or anything that people should be condemned for. Now I have nothing against people who divorce, just pointing that out, just like I have nothing against people who are gay, I mean I am part of the community for many reasons but still. Anyway, that isn't even my entire opinion seeing as you probably won't change yours, but anyway that is my two cents. Take care.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 11th 2016, 01:29 AM

Just a casual question for the OP. I'm curious as to the exact day, time, and circumstances in which you decided to be a heterosexual individual. How did you decide that this was the right path for you? When did you determine, after careful consideration and balancing pros and cons, that being sexually attracted to members of the opposite biological sex was "your thing"?


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 11th 2016, 08:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessOne View Post
I do not judge character. But I have a strong opinion on Homosexuality: it's not natural; its a choice. Every species that need two two reproduce have one Male and one Female. That is how God intended everything to be. Homosexuality has been debunked to a decision to give into sexual attraction of another of the same sex. This is a urge. It is a choice whether or not you accept to follow this sin or not. Now adays we have to be accomodading. I think this is ridiculous. You trick your mind after you give into the false urges that desire and are turned off of the opposite of normal funtioning people. I had a few friends that were "gay" but after they grew up a while they decided to be straight. I don't hate people, I just disagree with one's choices.
I'm confused. Are you saying it's your opinion that homosexuality has been debunked? Because nearly every study shows sexual orientation is not a choice. Hence why, assuming you're straight, you are straight without a choice. This doesn't mean your preferences cannot change (as in the case of your friends), in fact, science SUPPORTS this. For example, when I was younger, I HATED spinach. I would throw up just by eating it because it disgusted me. Now, I love it. It's one of my favorite vegetables. While this is obviously on a different scale, it shows my point: (Sexual) Preferences change -- they aren't choices.

Secondly, rather than posting your opinion on homosexuality being a sin, why don't you address your own sins before being so quick to address others alleged 'sins.' Because, according to your bible, you're equally as sinful in God's eyes and he hates your choices just as much as anyone elses. So, in the words of Jesus, pluck the log out of your own eye before point out the spec of dust in another's.


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 11th 2016, 09:00 PM

Of course you're entitled to your opinion, I just have to disagree entirely. I don't think I have anything to add I just hope the numerous posters with scientific proof and entirely valid reasons have encouraged you to change your perspective


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Re: Please don't hate my opinion - May 13th 2016, 03:19 AM

I can't believe I used to argue against homosexuality on TH. Despite hitting on my best friend, a guy, every time he spent the night.
Can I ask this? Hell, you don't even have to answer it. But it is a common theory among psychologists and scientists that the people who rail against homosexuality the most are covering up their own homosexuality. Worked for me on bisexuality, what about you?


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