TeenHelp
Support Forums Today's Posts

Get Advice Connect with TeenHelp Resources
HelpLINK Facebook     Twitter     Tumblr     Instagram    Hotlines    Safety Zone    Alternatives


You are not registered or have not logged in

Hello guest! (Not a guest? Log in above!)

As a guest on TeenHelp you are only able to use some of our site's features. By registering an account you will be able to enjoy unlimited access to our site, and will be able to:

  • Connect with thousands of teenagers worldwide by actively taking part in our Support Forums and Chat Room.
  • Find others with similar interests in our Social Groups.
  • Express yourself through our Blogs, Picture Albums and User Profiles.
  • And much much more!

Signing up is free, anonymous and will only take a few moments, so click here to register now!


Current Events and Debates For discussions and friendly debates about politics and current events, check out this forum.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  (#1 (permalink)) Old
FlyingTrue Offline
Member
I've been here a while
********
 
FlyingTrue's Avatar
 
Age: 28
Gender: Male
Location: United States (FL)

Posts: 1,048
Join Date: March 31st 2010

Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 02:28 AM

The story:
http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/wpi...,5162499.story
  Send a message via Skype™ to FlyingTrue 
  (#2 (permalink)) Old
ellabellax Offline
ella x
Welcome me, I'm new!
*
 
ellabellax's Avatar
 
Gender: Female

Posts: 26
Join Date: October 23rd 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 03:16 AM

Omg! Thats so retarded! As if its the kids fault!!
   
  (#3 (permalink)) Old
Blackwing Offline
I can't get enough
*********
 
Blackwing's Avatar
 
Name: Zack
Gender: Male
Location: Arizona(Usa)

Posts: 2,841
Blog Entries: 3
Join Date: January 7th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 03:17 AM

What a stupid Judge should be removed.


  Send a message via AIM to Blackwing  
  (#4 (permalink)) Old
MegaMadness Offline
Fight My Llama
Jeez, get a life!
***********
 
MegaMadness's Avatar
 
Name: Megan
Age: 24
Gender: Female
Location: Aussie Land

Posts: 5,564
Blog Entries: 16
Join Date: October 11th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 04:17 AM

This dosen't really seem right. It's a 4 year old kid here.


Come on boys, come on girls
In this crazy, crazy world
Youíre the diamonds, youíre the pearls
Letís make a new tomorrow
Come on girls, come on boys
Itís your future, itís your choice
And your weapon is your voice
Letís make a new tomorrow
Today
follow me please. I'll follow back. http://photographicjournal.tumblr.com/
   
  (#5 (permalink)) Old
Xujhan Offline
Resident Atheist
I can't get enough
*********
 
Xujhan's Avatar
 
Name: Fletcher
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Location: Ontario, Canada

Posts: 2,024
Join Date: January 17th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 06:18 AM

...derp?

Does this actually make sense to anyone?


The atoms that make up you and me were born in the hearts of suns many times greater than ours, and in time our atoms will once again reside amongst the stars. Life is but an idle dalliance of the cosmos, frail, and soon forgotten. We have been set adrift in an ocean whose tides we are only beginning to comprehend and with that maturity has come the realization that we are, at least for now, alone. In that loneliness, it falls to us to shine as brightly as the stars from which we came.
  Send a message via MSN to Xujhan  
  (#6 (permalink)) Old
emma01 Offline
Member
I've been here a while
********
 
emma01's Avatar
 
Name: Emma
Age: 25
Gender: Female

Posts: 1,386
Join Date: October 5th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 06:58 AM

That story sounded more like one a 4 year old would write...made no real sense to me

Anyway..how retarded...I dont really have anything to say about that apart from Stupid judge!
   
  (#7 (permalink)) Old
Hominis Offline
Life and death in every step.
Welcome me, I'm new!
*
 
Hominis's Avatar
 
Name: Jeremy [Ghost]
Gender: Male
Location: New York.

Posts: 34
Blog Entries: 2
Join Date: December 11th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 07:24 AM

Stupid people = stupid society.


.never tickle a sleeping dragon.
  Send a message via AIM to Hominis Send a message via MSN to Hominis Send a message via Skype™ to Hominis 
  (#8 (permalink)) Old
IH8U2 Offline
Member
Experienced TeenHelper
******
 
IH8U2's Avatar
 
Age: 32
Gender: Male

Posts: 610
Join Date: January 14th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 09:26 AM

I'm sorry, but I would definitely be mad at those two kids and their mothers. I don't know if the judge is right though.
   
  (#9 (permalink)) Old
Lotus Eater Offline
You are not alone.
Experienced TeenHelper
******
 
Lotus Eater's Avatar
 
Age: 27
Gender: Female
Location: Under The Sea

Posts: 561
Join Date: November 24th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 10:19 AM

She's four! And it was an accident.


You have me.
Until every last star in the galaxy dies.
You have me.

- Amie Kaufman



NEED TO VENT? CLICK HERE.
Never forget, you are not alone. ♥
   
  (#10 (permalink)) Old
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
her_beautiful_mistake's Avatar
 
Name: Rachel
Gender: Female
Location: Britland

Posts: 2,261
Blog Entries: 29
Join Date: January 18th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 10:56 AM

Oh god! Only in America! THAT IS RIDICULOUS


(RAH)≤ + (AH)≥ + RO(MA + MAMA) + (GA)≤ + OOH + (LA)≤ = Bad Romance

Religion is like a penis.
It's fine to have one.
It's fine to be proud of it.
But please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
And PLEASE don't try and shove it down my throat.
   
  (#11 (permalink)) Old
noise94 Offline
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
noise94's Avatar
 
Gender: N/A

Posts: 3,231
Join Date: January 11th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 10:59 AM

Ehh I always thought the age was like, 7, and under that you couldn't be held legally responsible?

Aaayway, this is just ridiculous. Complete insanity.
   
  (#12 (permalink)) Old
ForeverAutumn* Offline
together, we are infinite.
Senior TeenHelper
*******
 
ForeverAutumn*'s Avatar
 
Age: 25
Gender: Female

Posts: 843
Blog Entries: 20
Join Date: January 5th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 12:49 PM

This, right here, is the definition of America.



how could anyone ever tell you, you are anything less than beautiful?| PM Me
self-harm free since 06.10.11.
   
  (#13 (permalink)) Old
Voldermorts Stalker
I can't get enough
*********
 
WhisperingSilence's Avatar
 
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Location: where ever the coffee is

Posts: 3,469
Blog Entries: 1477
Join Date: January 6th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 01:27 PM

that is just wrong, i work in a preschool we have the bikes out at the preschool for the kids to play with, the kids run into me with the bikes, im not going round sueing them for it, theyre just innocent kids. that judge is unfair and stupid.



BADGER BADGER BADGER.........MUSHROOM!!!
Videos team
, articles team and helplink mentor and associate live help operator.
   
  (#14 (permalink)) Old
Skeleton Offline
Member
Outside, huh?
**********
 
Skeleton's Avatar
 
Name: Charlie
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Location: UK.

Posts: 4,544
Join Date: January 6th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 01:30 PM

I highly doubt those four years old went out on their bikes thinking "I'm going to mow down some elderly woman today". Accidents happen and they probably never intended for that to happen, to sue them for it would be completely and utterly stupid.
   
  (#15 (permalink)) Old
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
her_beautiful_mistake's Avatar
 
Name: Rachel
Gender: Female
Location: Britland

Posts: 2,261
Blog Entries: 29
Join Date: January 18th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 02:19 PM

You cannot be serious. How exactly is an accident the fault of the parents? How do you know that they were not watching their kids but were not able to prevent them running into the elderly woman?

If they had run into a younger adult it wouldn't have been a problem, it is just very unfortunate that they accidentally ran into an elderly woman & so the effects of a low fall were clearly more serious.

It was an accident. Accidents happen. America needs to stop being so fucking trigger-happy with the suing thing. It's laughable and completely ridiculous.


(RAH)≤ + (AH)≥ + RO(MA + MAMA) + (GA)≤ + OOH + (LA)≤ = Bad Romance

Religion is like a penis.
It's fine to have one.
It's fine to be proud of it.
But please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
And PLEASE don't try and shove it down my throat.

Last edited by Rob; January 19th 2019 at 01:51 AM.
   
  (#16 (permalink)) Old
Marguerite Offline
Member
I've been here a while
********
 
Marguerite's Avatar
 
Name: Marguerite
Age: 26
Gender: Female
Location: Australia

Posts: 1,064
Blog Entries: 2
Join Date: June 1st 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 02:50 PM

Okay, I think you're being serious (ignore this if you're joking) and I think that's a bit ridiculous. I don't know why four year old children are riding their bikes alone in the street, but still, come on...

To sue someone because their four year old kid accidently ran into your grandmother, knocked her over and she died as a result is pretty cruel and greedy.

Fair enough if you want to sue someone for doing the wrong thing and you want to see some justice, but this was an ACCIDENT caused by a FOUR YEAR OLD CHILD with no bad intent. That's money grubbing plain and simple.

Manslaughter? Really?


To love. To be loved. To never forget your own insignificance. To never get used to the unspeakable violence and the vulgar disparity of life around you. To seek joy in the saddest places. To pursue beauty to its lair. To never simplify what is complicated or complicate what is simple. To respect strength, never power. Above all, to watch. To try and understand. To never look away. And never, never, to forget

~Arundhati Roy

Last edited by Rob; January 19th 2019 at 01:52 AM.
   
  (#17 (permalink)) Old
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
her_beautiful_mistake's Avatar
 
Name: Rachel
Gender: Female
Location: Britland

Posts: 2,261
Blog Entries: 29
Join Date: January 18th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 06:20 PM

I would be grieving for my grandmother, not furious, and I would feel very sympathetic for the parents of the children responsible. And for the children; at 4 years old they may have limited understanding of what 'they' have 'done' but they will grow up with that responsibility and know that the family blame them. I would go out of my way to make the families involved know that I don't blame them in any way.

When really it's just unfortunate. The old lady clearly had osteoporosis and other related difficulties. She could have tripped over the curb or fallen on a wet patch on her kitchen floor or tripped going down the stairs and the outcome would have been the same. It's terribly sad and I feel bad for the family but they are reacting in a completely inappropriate way.


(RAH)≤ + (AH)≥ + RO(MA + MAMA) + (GA)≤ + OOH + (LA)≤ = Bad Romance

Religion is like a penis.
It's fine to have one.
It's fine to be proud of it.
But please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
And PLEASE don't try and shove it down my throat.
   
  (#18 (permalink)) Old
Stupidity Kills
Outside, huh?
**********
 
OMFG!You'reActuallySmart!'s Avatar
 

Posts: 4,500
Blog Entries: 10
Join Date: December 19th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 30th 2010, 10:27 PM

Only in the US do you get such a case and such a response as yours.

Being furious doesn't matter in this because the whole event and story is ridiculous from the start. How and why the judge decided to allow this case is beyond me.

In the criminal cases, the child has to be able to understand the consequences, communicate to lawyers, judge and others, and understand the process. A four-year old cannot truly understand this, which is why it's stupid to sue them for negligence or even something as ridiculous as manslaughter (or suing the parents for manslaughter is just as ridiculous).

But let's pretend you were the family member and sued the child. How should the child be punished? Juvenille detention, psychiatric institution, prison, house arrest, payment? How should the child be punished because if there's no suitable punishment, then there's no case. The people who should be sued are the parents for medical bills and emotional damages. Add in negligence on their part if it's so desired but manslaughter is unfitting.

You don't believe the death should be taken lightly, but do you think it should be approach sensibly or with nonsense? (Redundant question)


I can rip you off, and steal all your cash, suckerpunch you in the face, stand back and laugh. Leave you stranded as fast as a heart-attack.
- Danko Jones (I Think Bad Thoughts)

Last edited by Rob; January 19th 2019 at 01:54 AM.
   
  (#19 (permalink)) Old
Xujhan Offline
Resident Atheist
I can't get enough
*********
 
Xujhan's Avatar
 
Name: Fletcher
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Location: Ontario, Canada

Posts: 2,024
Join Date: January 17th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 01:44 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by her_beautiful_mistake View Post
I would be grieving for my grandmother, not furious, and I would feel very sympathetic for the parents of the children responsible. And for the children; at 4 years old they may have limited understanding of what 'they' have 'done' but they will grow up with that responsibility and know that the family blame them. I would go out of my way to make the families involved know that I don't blame them in any way.

When really it's just unfortunate. The old lady clearly had osteoporosis and other related difficulties. She could have tripped over the curb or fallen on a wet patch on her kitchen floor or tripped going down the stairs and the outcome would have been the same. It's terribly sad and I feel bad for the family but they are reacting in a completely inappropriate way.
This would be my reaction too. That something tragic happened should not give us reason to go looking for a scapegoat. No child so young can be held responsible for any action, and no parent should be expected to keep an eye on their children 100% of the time. I say should, because sadly some people do think that a parent can reasonably be expected to do so; a symptom of the paranoid culture we live in.


The atoms that make up you and me were born in the hearts of suns many times greater than ours, and in time our atoms will once again reside amongst the stars. Life is but an idle dalliance of the cosmos, frail, and soon forgotten. We have been set adrift in an ocean whose tides we are only beginning to comprehend and with that maturity has come the realization that we are, at least for now, alone. In that loneliness, it falls to us to shine as brightly as the stars from which we came.
  Send a message via MSN to Xujhan  
  (#20 (permalink)) Old
Kitty. Offline
Member
Jeez, get a life!
***********
 
Kitty.'s Avatar
 
Name: Kitty
Gender: Female

Posts: 6,268
Join Date: January 23rd 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 02:21 AM

The death of the lady is tragic, but the 4 year old or the parents shouldn't be sued. Why in the world does everyone want to sue over everything nowadays?
  Send a message via MSN to Kitty.  
  (#21 (permalink)) Old
Casey. Offline
Dance with me
I can't get enough
*********
 
Casey.'s Avatar
 
Name: Casey
Age: 30
Gender: Female
Location: Somewhere in my mind

Posts: 2,343
Blog Entries: 337
Join Date: January 6th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 02:37 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by her_beautiful_mistake View Post
I would be grieving for my grandmother, not furious, and I would feel very sympathetic for the parents of the children responsible. And for the children; at 4 years old they may have limited understanding of what 'they' have 'done' but they will grow up with that responsibility and know that the family blame them. I would go out of my way to make the families involved know that I don't blame them in any way.

When really it's just unfortunate. The old lady clearly had osteoporosis and other related difficulties. She could have tripped over the curb or fallen on a wet patch on her kitchen floor or tripped going down the stairs and the outcome would have been the same. It's terribly sad and I feel bad for the family but they are reacting in a completely inappropriate way.
This. Also, although they have a case, it's a very weak one. It was an accident and accidents happen.


She whispered to her own reflection "I will be strong."

"I am not what has happened to me.I am what I have chosen to become."- Carl Jung

"If ye harm none, do as ye wish."

Sometimes things just happen.


Smile through the tears.


PM me

  Send a message via Yahoo to Casey.  
  (#22 (permalink)) Old
Toast Offline
lostinaworldofhate
I've been here a while
********
 
Toast's Avatar
 
Name: Toast
Gender: Female
Location: Canada

Posts: 1,285
Join Date: January 9th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 03:24 AM

Perhaps it was an accident, but it was also preventable. The parents should have done something. The world isn't responsible for your kids, its your respensibility to make sure your kids don't kill little old ladies. So no, I don't think suing the parents is unreasonable. Suing the kid? Yes, that's unreasonable.


Heaven is high and earth wide. If you ride three feet higher above the ground than other men, you will know what that means. ~Rudolf C. Binding
   
  (#23 (permalink)) Old
MadPoet Offline
You're the Original <3
Outside, huh?
**********
 
MadPoet's Avatar
 
Name: Amanda.
Age: 24
Gender: Female.
Location: Michigan.

Posts: 4,685
Blog Entries: 121
Join Date: January 8th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 04:01 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
Perhaps it was an accident, but it was also preventable. The parents should have done something. The world isn't responsible for your kids, its your respensibility to make sure your kids don't kill little old ladies. So no, I don't think suing the parents is unreasonable. Suing the kid? Yes, that's unreasonable.
I agree, completely. Obviously the parents weren't paying close enough attention. If they had been, it could have been prevented. But obviously the four year old isn't to blame, they don't know one way or the other.





A lonely soul in a land of broken hearts


   
  (#24 (permalink)) Old
Xujhan Offline
Resident Atheist
I can't get enough
*********
 
Xujhan's Avatar
 
Name: Fletcher
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Location: Ontario, Canada

Posts: 2,024
Join Date: January 17th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 08:23 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
Perhaps it was an accident, but it was also preventable. The parents should have done something. The world isn't responsible for your kids, its your respensibility to make sure your kids don't kill little old ladies. So no, I don't think suing the parents is unreasonable. Suing the kid? Yes, that's unreasonable.
Most accidents are preventable. There's a very relevant difference between negligence and criminal negligence, and I get the feeling that some people are missing that. As a parent, yes, it's your responsibility to look after your children. Does that make it criminal for you to not be overlooking their every move? Of course not. Hell, the other family could just as reasonably be blamed for not paying attention to where their granny was. By that I mean that both cases are absurd, obviously, but the same logic applies. There simply aren't enough hours in the day to pay 100% diligence to everything we're supposed to be responsible for.


The atoms that make up you and me were born in the hearts of suns many times greater than ours, and in time our atoms will once again reside amongst the stars. Life is but an idle dalliance of the cosmos, frail, and soon forgotten. We have been set adrift in an ocean whose tides we are only beginning to comprehend and with that maturity has come the realization that we are, at least for now, alone. In that loneliness, it falls to us to shine as brightly as the stars from which we came.
  Send a message via MSN to Xujhan  
  (#25 (permalink)) Old
Member
I've been here a while
********
 
ShimmeringFaerie's Avatar
 
Age: 29
Gender: Female
Location: Australia

Posts: 1,990
Join Date: March 22nd 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 11:47 AM

I'm a little confused as to what the actual cause of death was? It says that she sustained a hip fracture and underwent surgery for that. It doesn't mention any other injuries. And it says that she died three weeks after the incident. I've read other articles about the incident which say she died months later of natural causes.

These kids didn't kill her by knocking her over with their bikes. I think it's horrible that people want to sue them and make them responsible for a death that they didn't cause.
I think it's especially awful that the media is printing their names and blaming them for her death as well.



PM me!

Dreaming about the day
When you wake up and find
That what you're looking for
Has been here the whole time.
   
  (#26 (permalink)) Old
Maloo Offline
Maloooooo
I can't get enough
*********
 
Maloo's Avatar
 
Name: Lissa
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Location: The US

Posts: 2,585
Blog Entries: 3
Join Date: January 12th 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 03:36 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post
I'm a little confused as to what the actual cause of death was? It says that she sustained a hip fracture and underwent surgery for that. It doesn't mention any other injuries. And it says that she died three weeks after the incident. I've read other articles about the incident which say she died months later of natural causes.

These kids didn't kill her by knocking her over with their bikes. I think it's horrible that people want to sue them and make them responsible for a death that they didn't cause.
I think it's especially awful that the media is printing their names and blaming them for her death as well.
I agree with this. It's a little sketchy that she dies 3 weeks later, but it was the children's fault?

I don't think the judge was right on his ruling, not because a 4-year-old doesn't know right from wrong, because they do, but that suing a 4-year-old is just ridiculous.
   
  (#27 (permalink)) Old
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
her_beautiful_mistake's Avatar
 
Name: Rachel
Gender: Female
Location: Britland

Posts: 2,261
Blog Entries: 29
Join Date: January 18th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 07:11 PM

What I took from it is that she sustained a hip/pelvic fracture following fall and died from complications a few weeks later. It's very common in elderly patients which is why I made the point about it just being unfortunate that the fracture happened in these circumstances.


(RAH)≤ + (AH)≥ + RO(MA + MAMA) + (GA)≤ + OOH + (LA)≤ = Bad Romance

Religion is like a penis.
It's fine to have one.
It's fine to be proud of it.
But please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
And PLEASE don't try and shove it down my throat.
   
  (#28 (permalink)) Old
dr2005 Offline
Legal Beagle
I can't get enough
*********
 
dr2005's Avatar
 
Name: Dave
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Location: UK

Posts: 2,221
Join Date: February 14th 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - October 31st 2010, 08:12 PM

I'm with Fletcher and Rachel on this one - however preventable the circumstances may have been, this has no place whatsoever in a court of law and frankly I'd be surprised if this gets past appeal. I also doubt it will do that particular judge's fitness to practice renewal many favours. We have a presumption in English law called doli incapax which states that a child under the age of 10 cannot be held legally responsible for their actions (criminal or civil), and if the US courts have abandoned that then it is sheer lunacy.

The thing which worries me even more is that he based his decision on New York case law, which apparently has a precedent for this. If that is the case then my faith in the basic rationality of humanity just went straight down the toilet...

EDIT: I've just found an article on the New York Times website which says that the woman died "of unrelated causes". (Source) If that is the case then that breaks the causal chain as far as the bike incident and her death is concerned and would limit any potential liability to injuries sustained from the fall. That said, I still stand by my earlier viewpoint that this is lunacy.


"The greatest glory in living lies not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall." - Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

However bleak things seem, however insurmountable the darkness appears, remember that you have worth and nothing can take that away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OMFG!You'reActuallySmart! View Post
If you're referring to dr2005's response, it's not complex, however, he has a way with words .
RIP Nick

Last edited by dr2005; October 31st 2010 at 08:21 PM.
   
  (#29 (permalink)) Old
Toast Offline
lostinaworldofhate
I've been here a while
********
 
Toast's Avatar
 
Name: Toast
Gender: Female
Location: Canada

Posts: 1,285
Join Date: January 9th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 1st 2010, 04:59 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xujhan View Post
Most accidents are preventable. There's a very relevant difference between negligence and criminal negligence, and I get the feeling that some people are missing that. As a parent, yes, it's your responsibility to look after your children. Does that make it criminal for you to not be overlooking their every move? Of course not.
I disagree with you. Sure, every parent has some time when they aren't watching their kid, but when your negligence causes the death of someone? I think you should be prepared to accept the consequences. (this is based on the assumption that the kid caused the death, I'm aware that there is a possibility that it didn't, which is an entirely different debate)


Heaven is high and earth wide. If you ride three feet higher above the ground than other men, you will know what that means. ~Rudolf C. Binding
   
  (#30 (permalink)) Old
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
her_beautiful_mistake's Avatar
 
Name: Rachel
Gender: Female
Location: Britland

Posts: 2,261
Blog Entries: 29
Join Date: January 18th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 1st 2010, 09:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
I disagree with you. Sure, every parent has some time when they aren't watching their kid, but when your negligence causes the death of someone? I think you should be prepared to accept the consequences. (this is based on the assumption that the kid caused the death, I'm aware that there is a possibility that it didn't, which is an entirely different debate)
Do you expect every parent to be within arms reach of their child, constantly? That is what you are asking here.


(RAH)≤ + (AH)≥ + RO(MA + MAMA) + (GA)≤ + OOH + (LA)≤ = Bad Romance

Religion is like a penis.
It's fine to have one.
It's fine to be proud of it.
But please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
And PLEASE don't try and shove it down my throat.
   
  (#31 (permalink)) Old
Simplyme7 Offline
Member
Regular TeenHelper
*****
 
Simplyme7's Avatar
 
Age: 27
Gender: Female
Location: In a land all my own

Posts: 361
Join Date: March 15th 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 1st 2010, 10:15 PM

First off, what are they gonna sue the little girl for? Her Barbie collection? I mean seriously, people are down right stupid now and days.

Next, those poor little kids were probably scared to death when they ran into the lady. You people in here who say that the parents should have stopped them have obviously never walked with a young child as they raced their bikes. Most of the time you a few yards behind them, and even if you were to try to run up to stop them, there really wouldn't have been enough time. And like I said before, the kids were probably scared enough that they didn't know what to do. At 4 they don't have those reasoning skills neccesary to stop from being in an accident.

And thats all that this was, an accident. The elderly lady's family is just being plain stupid. They are upset that their grandma died, and are in turn trying to take it out on a poor little 4 year old girl. Like the old saying, "Misery loves company."

What the heck is the world coming to? When babies can be sued just for running into a lady? They didn't kill her on contact, and according to The New York Times
Quote:
An article in some editions on Friday about a lawsuit that claims an elderly woman was severely injured by two children racing their bicycles on a Manhattan sidewalk misstated the timing of the womanís death. The woman, Claire Menagh, died of unrelated causes three months after she was struck, not three weeks.
This case should be thrown out, and the judge should be put on probation or something.




   
  (#32 (permalink)) Old
Stupidity Kills
Outside, huh?
**********
 
OMFG!You'reActuallySmart!'s Avatar
 

Posts: 4,500
Blog Entries: 10
Join Date: December 19th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 1st 2010, 11:24 PM

The article stated the girl's age incorrectly and the victim died 3 months later of unrelated causes. I thought the incident was ridiculous to begin with and approaching the rabbit hole but now I think it's quite far down the rabbit hole. The case should've been tossed out from the start and I cant see any reason why it shouldn't be tossed out now (couldn't see any to begin with). I'm sure there's a punishment the judge can get for allowing this nonsense to go through and they should get it.


I can rip you off, and steal all your cash, suckerpunch you in the face, stand back and laugh. Leave you stranded as fast as a heart-attack.
- Danko Jones (I Think Bad Thoughts)
   
  (#33 (permalink)) Old
Xujhan Offline
Resident Atheist
I can't get enough
*********
 
Xujhan's Avatar
 
Name: Fletcher
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Location: Ontario, Canada

Posts: 2,024
Join Date: January 17th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 1st 2010, 11:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
I disagree with you. Sure, every parent has some time when they aren't watching their kid, but when your negligence causes the death of someone? I think you should be prepared to accept the consequences. (this is based on the assumption that the kid caused the death, I'm aware that there is a possibility that it didn't, which is an entirely different debate)
People are not responsible when their ordinary, acceptable actions unintentionally cause tragic results. If you want to prosecute someone, they must have done something wrong. Either you claim that it is wrong for a parent to not be paying 100% attention to your child, or you accept that the parents cannot be held accountable for this. For a clearer example:

You drive over to your friend's house and park your car by the sidewalk. Later, a passing jogger slips on a wet patch he failed to notice. As he falls, he smashes his head off your car door and gets a serious concussion. A few weeks later, he dies of complications. Had your car not been there, he'd probably have escaped with just a few scrapes. Your choice of parking space directly led to his death. Are you responsible?


The atoms that make up you and me were born in the hearts of suns many times greater than ours, and in time our atoms will once again reside amongst the stars. Life is but an idle dalliance of the cosmos, frail, and soon forgotten. We have been set adrift in an ocean whose tides we are only beginning to comprehend and with that maturity has come the realization that we are, at least for now, alone. In that loneliness, it falls to us to shine as brightly as the stars from which we came.
  Send a message via MSN to Xujhan  
  (#34 (permalink)) Old
Toast Offline
lostinaworldofhate
I've been here a while
********
 
Toast's Avatar
 
Name: Toast
Gender: Female
Location: Canada

Posts: 1,285
Join Date: January 9th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 12:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xujhan View Post
People are not responsible when their ordinary, acceptable actions unintentionally cause tragic results. If you want to prosecute someone, they must have done something wrong. Either you claim that it is wrong for a parent to not be paying 100% attention to your child, or you accept that the parents cannot be held accountable for this. For a clearer example:

You drive over to your friend's house and park your car by the sidewalk. Later, a passing jogger slips on a wet patch he failed to notice. As he falls, he smashes his head off your car door and gets a serious concussion. A few weeks later, he dies of complications. Had your car not been there, he'd probably have escaped with just a few scrapes. Your choice of parking space directly led to his death. Are you responsible?
That's hardly comparable. In your example, the jogger caused the accident himself. In this story, the kid caused the accident. If I am driving my car and slide on a patch of ice, then hit and kill a pedestrian, am I responsible? Of course I am, even though I wasn't trying to kill them. Though perhaps my views on this are swayed by the fact that I am really sick of people expecting society to raise their kids and everyone else to put up with them. Whenever I hear a kid's squeaky whine in public, I want to strangle someone. Taking away someone's right to live because of your negligence? That just bothers me.

(Again, this opinion is based on the assumption that being hit by a bike did cause the death. It sounds like the bike might have been unrelated to the death, in which case this is unreasonable)


Heaven is high and earth wide. If you ride three feet higher above the ground than other men, you will know what that means. ~Rudolf C. Binding

Last edited by Toast; November 2nd 2010 at 12:38 AM.
   
  (#35 (permalink)) Old
Stupidity Kills
Outside, huh?
**********
 
OMFG!You'reActuallySmart!'s Avatar
 

Posts: 4,500
Blog Entries: 10
Join Date: December 19th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 02:47 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
(Again, this opinion is based on the assumption that being hit by a bike did cause the death. It sounds like the bike might have been unrelated to the death, in which case this is unreasonable)
According to the correction in the source, it was an unrelated death that happened 3 months after the kid knocked down the lady who was already in poor health. Very unreasonable.


I can rip you off, and steal all your cash, suckerpunch you in the face, stand back and laugh. Leave you stranded as fast as a heart-attack.
- Danko Jones (I Think Bad Thoughts)
   
  (#36 (permalink)) Old
Xujhan Offline
Resident Atheist
I can't get enough
*********
 
Xujhan's Avatar
 
Name: Fletcher
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Location: Ontario, Canada

Posts: 2,024
Join Date: January 17th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 04:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
That's hardly comparable. In your example, the jogger caused the accident himself. In this story, the kid caused the accident. If I am driving my car and slide on a patch of ice, then hit and kill a pedestrian, am I responsible? Of course I am, even though I wasn't trying to kill them. Though perhaps my views on this are swayed by the fact that I am really sick of people expecting society to raise their kids and everyone else to put up with them. Whenever I hear a kid's squeaky whine in public, I want to strangle someone. Taking away someone's right to live because of your negligence? That just bothers me.

(Again, this opinion is based on the assumption that being hit by a bike did cause the death. It sounds like the bike might have been unrelated to the death, in which case this is unreasonable)
The jogger would no more have caused the accident than the old woman did by not getting out of the way. If you're driving a car, you're expected to try to keep control of it at all times. Of course we don't expect that everyone will, but that's the goal we all should aim for. With kids, that's not the case. If someone were to be a step away from their children at all times, we'd consider them to be doing a pretty poor job of balancing their life, and likely being far too protective a parent. You do not punish someone for doing something that is doing generally the right thing. If it were generally thought good to be hovering over your kids constantly, and that we don't expect people to only because we recognize human failings, then you'd have an argument.

Though speaking of things that bother: "taking away someone's right to live." This is what I was talking about a couple posts ago: the idea that any time something tragic happens we should go hunting for a scapegoat. Taking implies intent, or at very least direct responsibility.


The atoms that make up you and me were born in the hearts of suns many times greater than ours, and in time our atoms will once again reside amongst the stars. Life is but an idle dalliance of the cosmos, frail, and soon forgotten. We have been set adrift in an ocean whose tides we are only beginning to comprehend and with that maturity has come the realization that we are, at least for now, alone. In that loneliness, it falls to us to shine as brightly as the stars from which we came.
  Send a message via MSN to Xujhan  
  (#37 (permalink)) Old
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
her_beautiful_mistake's Avatar
 
Name: Rachel
Gender: Female
Location: Britland

Posts: 2,261
Blog Entries: 29
Join Date: January 18th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 10:55 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
That's hardly comparable. In your example, the jogger caused the accident himself. In this story, the kid caused the accident. If I am driving my car and slide on a patch of ice, then hit and kill a pedestrian, am I responsible? Of course I am, even though I wasn't trying to kill them. Though perhaps my views on this are swayed by the fact that I am really sick of people expecting society to raise their kids and everyone else to put up with them. Whenever I hear a kid's squeaky whine in public, I want to strangle someone. Taking away someone's right to live because of your negligence? That just bothers me.

(Again, this opinion is based on the assumption that being hit by a bike did cause the death. It sounds like the bike might have been unrelated to the death, in which case this is unreasonable)
you haven't answered my question. In situations like these the parents would have to be within arms reach of their children to prevent accidents occurring definitely. So therefore you believe that no parent should ever be more than an arms reach away from their child?


(RAH)≤ + (AH)≥ + RO(MA + MAMA) + (GA)≤ + OOH + (LA)≤ = Bad Romance

Religion is like a penis.
It's fine to have one.
It's fine to be proud of it.
But please don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
And PLEASE don't try and shove it down my throat.
   
  (#38 (permalink)) Old
Ali Baba Offline
Honesty, Loyalty, Respect.
Junior TeenHelper
****
 
Ali Baba's Avatar
 
Name: Alexandra
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Location: Ireland

Posts: 258
Join Date: August 22nd 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 11:26 AM

Pfff wtf?? This is a load of Bull. A 4 year old can't be sued under tort. "Harm must be (1) reasonably foreseeable (2) there must be a relationship of proximity between the plaintiff and defendant and (3) it must be 'fair, just and reasonable' to impose liability". "reasonably forseeable"...it must be forseeable by a reasonable man ie. someone without mental health problems, illness etc, and who is at or above THE AGE OF MAJORITY. How is it fair to sue a 4 year old and how at the age of four can she be treated as having the mind of "a reasonable man". This is really bad law. How is it negligent of the child?? I'm really confused by this lol. The minumum age in the states is apparently 7 years old. Judge clearly can't count...
   
  (#39 (permalink)) Old
Toast Offline
lostinaworldofhate
I've been here a while
********
 
Toast's Avatar
 
Name: Toast
Gender: Female
Location: Canada

Posts: 1,285
Join Date: January 9th 2009

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 09:58 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xujhan;5114[SIZE=1
73][/size] This is what I was talking about a couple posts ago: the idea that any time something tragic happens we should go hunting for a scapegoat. Taking implies intent, or at very least direct responsibility.
I'm not the kind of person who goes looking for a scapegoat. If a person gets hit by a train, is it the engineer's fault? No, it was a tragic accident. A child mowing down a little old lady and killing her? There's something unsettling about that. If your kid isn't very good on a bike, you should be supervising them. If not, then the kid must have been trying to hit her(In which case there is something very wrong). It's not that challenging to turn on a bike. I can do it on snow and ice. So yeah, I do think it's the parents' fault. You should be watching your kid if they're controlling a heavy metal thing and they aren't very good at it.


Heaven is high and earth wide. If you ride three feet higher above the ground than other men, you will know what that means. ~Rudolf C. Binding
   
  (#40 (permalink)) Old
Simplyme7 Offline
Member
Regular TeenHelper
*****
 
Simplyme7's Avatar
 
Age: 27
Gender: Female
Location: In a land all my own

Posts: 361
Join Date: March 15th 2010

Re: Judge: 4-year-old girl can be sued for accidentally killing elderly woman with bike - November 2nd 2010, 11:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toast View Post
. It's not that challenging to turn on a bike. I can do it on snow and ice.
You also are a teenager. You probably have been riding bikes for awhile now. This was a 4 year old CHILD. She still had training wheels according to one of the news sources listed above. She probably was scared to death, and panicked, and didn't know what to do. That's why little kids run into trees and such. She was only learning how to ride a bike, and she was not old enough to have that response time.

Also, as stated above, the old lady died because of UNRELATED causes. Therefore, this case should be thrown out.




   
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Tags
4yearold, accidentally, bike, elderly, girl, judge, killing, sued, woman

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




All material copyright ©1998-2019, TeenHelp.
Terms | Legal | Privacy | Conduct | Complaints

Powered by vBulletin®.
Copyright ©2000-2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search engine optimization by vBSEO.
Theme developed in association with vBStyles.