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Originally Posted by emma01
Funnily enough - if you are pressured to buy a car enough that you are afraid to say no, you are covered by the fair trading act. http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/p....html#DLM96949
We learned about this last year (bear in mind this is New Zealand) but if you are harrassed or pressured to buy a car, then you are covered!
Anyway...buying a car and sex is very different.
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Okay... regardless, no one would ever be charged for convincing someone to have sex because thankfully our society isn't that far gone yet. People get touchy when you start comparing things to rape or sex because it's starts the whole 'women are property' thing, and of course I don't think I'm property or that anyone has the right to rape me.
However changing my mind doesn't constitute rape and I know this because I'm not so weak minded that my response to being asked a few times to have sex would be to agree rather than to leave the room. As I've said before... if you are so scared that you feel you should just 'give in' rather than attempting to leave, there NEEDS to be a reason for you to feel like that. If it's just that you think:
'Wow, this guy keeps asking a lot. Even though he hasn't touched me/tried to block me from leaving/threatened me, it might escalate to that if I get head for the door. I guess I should just give in rather than risk being raped'.
Then sorry, you're being irrational. It's completely ridiculous to just 'go with it' because you assume, for no logical reason what so ever, that a guy who has made no attempt to harm you will rape you if you try to leave.
Quote:
Originally Posted by handgrenadeheart
That's a complete exaggeration. Yes, it would be wrong to call that rape. But that example is out of context and far from the point I was making.
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Sorry but how can I exargerrate and take out of context my own examples?
Quote:
Originally Posted by handgrenadeheart
The person asking should have taken no for an answer. It should be obvious to them that persuasion is taking advantage. If the other eventually agrees, it is agreeing out of pressure.
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1) You don't know that someone is agreeing out of pressure. I know you'll go off at me again for using a car example but to just stick with it for a second (while acknowleging that women are not property and blah blah blah) I might show you a new car. First you might think you don't need a car and refuse to buy it. But maybe I'll tell you about it's cool features and you'll begin to think it actually looks pretty good. But you know you shouldn't, you're saving up your money. So you say no again. Then I'll tell you that it's actually a pretty reliable car and you start to think how much fun you'd have in it. So you think, why not just once, this time? It's not like you go around buying cars all the time. Yes, I know, another car analogy. But my point isn't that women are like cars, it's that people can be persuaded into different things without doing it because they are stressed out and feel intimidated. And you're right, no means no. No doesn't mean 'try and convince someone to say yes', but this brings me to my next point.
2) Being a jerk doesn't equal being a law breaker. 'Taking advantage' in the sense you're talking about (emotional advantage) is pretty much a dick move but it's not illegal. Nobody is saying that these people are angels, and, on that, I'm certainly not saying that being in one of these situations isn't somehow less traumatic because it's not legally rape. I'm just saying that. It's not legally rape.
I just wanted to add that when I posted this, I considered making the sexes ambiguous and saying something like 'So if a person has sex with another person in this way, is it rape'? Because obviously, men get raped, by other men and women even. But the thing is I've never seen anyone act this way over a man's story.
To all the people calling the 'pressure' thing rape, I want to know what you'd say if a man said this to you:
"I was sitting with this girl at a party and she kept asking me for sex. I said no heaps of times, I've got a girlfriend, but she kept saying please. She didn't touch me, or try to stop me from leaving, or threaten me in any way. But I was scared and assumed she would anyway if I tried to leave, so I gave in and had sex with her. Is this rape?"