TeenHelp
Support Forums Today's Posts

Get Advice Connect with TeenHelp Resources
HelpLINK Facebook     Twitter     Tumblr     Instagram    Hotlines    Safety Zone    Alternatives

You are not registered or have not logged in

Hello guest! (Not a guest? Log in above!)

As a guest on TeenHelp you are only able to use some of our site's features. By registering an account you will be able to enjoy unlimited access to our site, and will be able to:

  • Connect with thousands of teenagers worldwide by actively taking part in our Support Forums and Chat Room.
  • Find others with similar interests in our Social Groups.
  • Express yourself through our Blogs, Picture Albums and User Profiles.
  • And much much more!

Signing up is free, anonymous and will only take a few moments, so click here to register now!


Current Events and Debates For discussions and friendly debates about politics and current events, check out this forum.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  (#1 (permalink)) Old
Catlady Offline
Member
Junior TeenHelper
****
 
Catlady's Avatar
 
Age: 19
Gender: Other
Location: USA

Posts: 243
Blog Entries: 1
Join Date: November 17th 2015

Trump vs World. - December 11th 2015, 05:10 AM

Hey everyone! Ok, so I am sure everyone knows about this whole Trump thing. First of all let me this is VERY hard for me to admit because I have had SOOO many people call me nasty, awful, horrid names from my political views. I am a conservative and I do support Trump. I know MANY disagree with me. However, this is what I feel. So my discussion is not to go back and forth about politics, because I have made my decision and your opinion is just as valid as mine. Do you feel that it is ok for someone to attack me because of how I feel? I want the biggest Trump hater on the website to see this and see if they attack me. Do you feel it is alright for someone else to have a different opinion, will you validate it? Not sure if this is where I should put this.. I just want to hear people's thoughts on this. Also, from experience with discussions. I am not racist. I am not an islamaphobic. ALSO, do you feel it is ok to compare anyone to Hitler regardless of how much you hate them? Because I think it is NOT. I believe the media is taking what Trump is saying and blowing it out of context to get views, just like they do with any other person. So, let's just have a discussion on this. Thanks Ps: please don't call me Hitler or a nazi because of my views. I have enough family/ friends calling me that. :/ Please feel free to move this if it is not where it belongs


Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future. ~Oscar Wilde.
   
  (#2 (permalink)) Old
Coffee. Offline
Condom Queen
TeenHelp Addict
************
 
Coffee.'s Avatar
 
Name: Traci
Age: 26
Gender: she/her/hers
Location: North Carolina

Posts: 8,147
Blog Entries: 639
Join Date: October 29th 2009

Re: Trump vs World. - December 11th 2015, 05:28 AM

Here's the answer to all of your questions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonely_cat_lady View Post
Do you feel that it is ok for someone to attack me because of how I feel?
Call you names and yell at you, no. Call you out in a constructive matter, yes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonely_cat_lady View Post
I want the biggest Trump hater on the website to see this and see if they attack me.
Hate Trump, not attacking you. I don't attack people. I'll just critically call them out as necessary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonely_cat_lady View Post
Do you feel it is alright for someone else to have a different opinion, will you validate it?
I'm okay with any opinion that doesn't harm the existence or hurt other people. But past that point, I'm not okay and will not tolerate it. I also don't think it's okay to be closed minded to learning other perspectives. It's not ethically wrong, but it serves you no good and you have no chance to learn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonely_cat_lady View Post
However, this is what I feel. So my discussion is not to go back and forth about politics, because I have made my decision and your opinion is just as valid as mine.
Let me give you some advice. Never have your decision final. Always be willing to change your mind. My political and life beliefs have changed drastically in the last ten years and it's for the better. Never stop growing.


I said to the sun, "Tell me about the big bang"
& the sun said “it hurts to become."
Andrea Gibson, "I Sing The Body Electric; Especially When My Power Is Out"
  Send a message via MSN to Coffee.  
  (#3 (permalink)) Old
cynefin Offline
Verbal venom.

TeenHelp Addict
************
 
cynefin's Avatar
 
Age: 21
Gender: Female
Location: 1261'

Posts: 9,843
Blog Entries: 1496
Join Date: August 25th 2012

Re: Trump vs World. - December 11th 2015, 05:28 AM

I'm not too much into politics or anything, but I do feel strongly about a few things. However, I don't generally discuss them outside of my family members and I don't post about them anywhere on the internet because I do not like to debate. Things tend to get heated wherever you go with a strong opinion and I try to avoid that by not posting about anything.

Everyone has a right to their opinion. Will I validate an opinion that is against mine? I do try to see different aspects of everyone's different opinions on things, yes. I don't think it's right to attack anyone for their difference in opinion, but there are people who will do that wherever you go in life.

You mentioned comparing things to Hitler and something about the media. As far as that goes, I honestly try not to watch the news anymore because it is depressing. I know of people who only look at positive news websites and I might check those out sometimes.

I do think that the media chooses what they want to show and part of that has to do with the individual channels and the companies that own them. There's currently something in question and the media is only showing the negative side (the side they believe in) instead of showing both sides. The other unbiased channels, or different informative websites show the positive side of the situation in question too. I don't want to get too detailed because like I said, I don't like arguing, and there are probably plenty of other similar instances out there.

But remember you do have a right to your opinion and it is just as valid as everyone else's opinion. Don't let anyone make you think otherwise.


Articles & Resources Officer|Lead Moderator|Senior Newsletter Editor
The mountains are calling and I must go.
1941-2016

Nature does not rush, yet everything is accomplished
-Lao Tzu
Memories made in the mountains stay in our hearts forever
Move the body, quiet the mind
   
  (#4 (permalink)) Old
Sophrosyne Offline
The Cute Half

I can't get enough
*********
 
Sophrosyne's Avatar
 
Name: Raven
Age: 19
Gender: Agender
Location: Narnia

Posts: 2,167
Join Date: April 11th 2015

Re: Trump vs World. - December 11th 2015, 09:23 AM

Ok first of all, no I do not think it is ok to be rude to someone about what they believe, that is silly and unnecessary and to be honest, its not actually going to convince someone to agree with you if you do that. I agree with Cassado in saying that I don't like arguing about these sorts of things, but really just because I don't know everything about the subject so there is no point.

It is great you have an opinion, but be willing to change your opinion because you never know, you might have got it wrong. Keep an open mind.

As for someone having a different opinion than yours, heck yes I think that it is perfectly fine to have a different opinion. No one has the same opinion as everyone else and that is perfectly fine. If no one had different opinions then the world wouldn't be any fun. However, I do not believe that it is ok to have an opinion that criticises another's existence or threatens someone's existence. Those types of opinions are not ok. They are hurtful and they are just generally not the right opinion to have anyway.

I don't really listen to the news and their views, I only really listen to the person themselves, and I don't really agree with Trumps views from what he has said not what others have said, so I really formed my own opinion about it. As I said before though, I don't care if someone has opposing opinions to me, that's fine as long as people don't attack each other for different views, which seems to be what a lot of people do.

Overall though, your family and friends making those comments would certainly not be nice, and in general they are hurtful and that's not ok. Its great you have different opinions to others, I know there are plenty of people that have the same opinion as you as well as people who have opposing opinions. I wouldn't really recommend trying to start an argument over it though because it really just isn't worth the time and effort.

Have fun anyway and good luck with other responses.


Senior HelpLINK Mentor | Forum Moderator
Clothed in strength and dignity,
and laughs without fear of the future.
   
  (#5 (permalink)) Old
BDF Offline
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
BDF's Avatar
 
Name: BDF
Age: 28
Gender: Male
Location: Europe

Posts: 2,523
Blog Entries: 1
Join Date: January 28th 2009

Re: Trump vs World. - December 11th 2015, 05:37 PM

Trump makes some good points and arguments... but nulls most of them by behaving almost like an emotional child in public, and also does make some very stupid points and argumets designed to appeal to a certain embittered and emotional % of the the public who only know how to react with outrage and hysteria to anything that isn't to their appetite. Oh don't get me wrong... I think there are a lot of people on the left side of politics who react similar, but I rarely see their mainstream politicians show the same colours, flinging arms around in front of cameras, pulling faces and deliberately talking in stupid voices.

And by "emotional child" I also mean things like the orangutan lawsuit... ffs. What demographic of the population would a politician launching a frivolous lawsuit like that appeal to? Are those are the kinds people he's trying to build a career on??? And that's the kind of example he wants to set??? Srsly??? I find it difficult to listen to him.

__________________________________________________ ____


BUT... about the other things you said... your family/friends hating on you. No it isn't right. My particular problem with Donald Trump is pretty much all that I've said above. I don't like his childish act, and I think they need to find someone better than him to represent them, and someone who will tone-it-down a bit too. Deporting migrants which have already been granted asylum is a very dishonest thing to do. It's going back on your word.

When younger, I have migrated (mostly with my mum) between countries for permanent residence about 6 or 7 times in my life. We had to put up occasionaly with assholes smashing our car because we were "foreign", spraying grafiti, and worse sometimes. I have never had much sympathy for far-right supporters, mostly no sympathy. I have learned to cope with people hating me. So has my mum. From that, you would assume I'd be on the left side of politics.

No.

I was on the left side for a while, and throughout secondary school years I started firmly believing
in "centre politics". Because: I have truly hated how I've seen people deamonized and called out as "racists" just for criticizing immigration, and silenced by things such as the threat of loosing their job because because of "bad PR". I hate hypocricy. I hate political correctness which has now been proven to undermine the justice system in the UK. A balanced political system means equality to both left and right, not biasing the culture in favor of one or the other. I hate "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas". I hate positive descrimination (equal opportunities start at pre-school, not in universities... but todlers don't vote for politicians and students do). And I hate the fucking dellusion some people have that racial minorities "can't be racist"...

... and I have seen recently that I am not the only one who hates all this. There are lots of people who hate it. But that does not mean I support "right wing" anything. It's like currency inflation, or grade inflation. Definitions change. With time, left-wing politics has inflated. What used to be regarded as "far-left", is now regarded as just "left-wing". What used to be "left-wing", became "centre", and what was "centre" became "right-wing".

And "right-wing" became "far-right-extremism", which makes me fucking laugh. ISIS is "far-right-extremism". Black Panthers, Westbro Baptist Church, Neo-NAZIs are forms of
"far-right-extremism". Not Donald Trump, or Nigel Farage... and definitely not David Cameron. I mean... if that's the case then jesus f christ was hatched from an easter egg, Christmas and the bible is a lie, and I've solved peace in the middle East.

This is exactly what I mean... people are trying to deamonize the opposing side in politics and compare people like Donald Trump, Nigel Farage... to Hitler, before they have even committed any kind of crime whatsoever. Ironically, many conflicts, fights and wars are started by people trying to prevent them... lashing out first with words, fists, or guns, in so called "self-defence".

If people keep alienating and profiling them as "far-right-extremists" instead of listening to what they have to say... then they and their supporters might just become exactly that. Same principle applies to Muslims, if you deamonize them, more of them will become extremists. Same principle applies to bringing up kids, where if you tell them that they are useless from a young age, they'll believe it, and become exactly that when they're older.

Same principle applies to almost any person alive, and what I can't stand is people who advertise themselves by virtue of their political inclinations as "open minded" and "tolerant", who at the same time spit venom and try to humiliate others for speaking against immigration, European Union, positive descrimination, etc. . Those people are not true liberals. They are nothing more than immature conformists and followers of a viral fucking pop-culture, without a shred of independent thinking or evidence of intelligence. They are making the problem of right-wing politics worse, not better. Of course this doesn't apply to all liberals, but I've seen and heard many like this. I don't know how many, but it could even be a majority (considering it is in many ways a pop-culture, that shouldn't be suprising).

So... don't let those people get inside your head. You should be proud that you're capable of thinking your own way and reaching your own conclusions, instead of just following media frenzies and crucifictions of people like Donald Sterling. You're not anything like Hitler (as hopefuly I've succesfuly explained using common sense). Otherwise, you have a lot of work to do to catch up to him.


.


"I don't care about politics"
Then politics doesn't care about you either. Truth. You've got to make your voice heard, if you want to be listened to. But that's too logical for some people, so let me go a step further. Not making your voice heard, leaves other people free to hijack it by speaking on your behalf, even if they don't actually give a shit about you. That's politics. So, make your voice heard. That's not a quote from anywhere. That's just me.



Last edited by BDF; December 12th 2015 at 05:50 PM.
   
  (#6 (permalink)) Old
Proud90sKid Offline
Member
Junior TeenHelper
****
 
Proud90sKid's Avatar
 
Name: .
Gender: Male
Location: US

Posts: 302
Join Date: July 6th 2011

Re: Trump vs World. - December 11th 2015, 06:10 PM

I'll admit that I haven't been following politics at all. So I might be a bit uninformed- but I like Trump and as it is right now, I'd vote for him-definitely over Hilary.He has made some remarks that are shocking but I don't feel that it should prevent him from being president. The truth is that we as people discriminate against groups every single day- and only a few groups are so protected by political correctness. I don't think making a politically incorrect statement off the cuff should bar him from presidency. The guy is a billionaire - he gets to fund his own campaign and say what he wants to without worrying about losing his sponsors. And I respect that.

The thing is - is that he so far hasn't said anything too conservative (but again- I haven't been following). I'm not a conservative and I won't vote for someone who wants to restrict personal freedom (like many conservatives do). I'm more of a libertarian- at least when it comes to personal choices. I don't want to vote for a Bush or a Romney- I want more of a neutral candidate if I were to vote Republican. I feel that most conservative viewpoints are too old fashioned and that Republicans NEED a candidate with more neutral values if they expect to win a presidential election in modern times. Reagan and Bush values are so outdated.
   
  (#7 (permalink)) Old
Catlady Offline
Member
Junior TeenHelper
****
 
Catlady's Avatar
 
Age: 19
Gender: Other
Location: USA

Posts: 243
Blog Entries: 1
Join Date: November 17th 2015

Re: Trump vs World. - December 12th 2015, 04:30 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coffee. View Post
Here's the answer to all of your questions.

Call you names and yell at you, no. Call you out in a constructive matter, yes.

Hate Trump, not attacking you. I don't attack people. I'll just critically call them out as necessary.

I'm okay with any opinion that doesn't harm the existence or hurt other people. But past that point, I'm not okay and will not tolerate it. I also don't think it's okay to be closed minded to learning other perspectives. It's not ethically wrong, but it serves you no good and you have no chance to learn.

Let me give you some advice. Never have your decision final. Always be willing to change your mind. My political and life beliefs have changed drastically in the last ten years and it's for the better. Never stop growing.
Sorry if I came off close minded. I honestly did not mean too. Thank you for the thoughts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cassado View Post
I'm not too much into politics or anything, but I do feel strongly about a few things. However, I don't generally discuss them outside of my family members and I don't post about them anywhere on the internet because I do not like to debate. Things tend to get heated wherever you go with a strong opinion and I try to avoid that by not posting about anything.

Everyone has a right to their opinion. Will I validate an opinion that is against mine? I do try to see different aspects of everyone's different opinions on things, yes. I don't think it's right to attack anyone for their difference in opinion, but there are people who will do that wherever you go in life.

You mentioned comparing things to Hitler and something about the media. As far as that goes, I honestly try not to watch the news anymore because it is depressing. I know of people who only look at positive news websites and I might check those out sometimes.

I do think that the media chooses what they want to show and part of that has to do with the individual channels and the companies that own them. There's currently something in question and the media is only showing the negative side (the side they believe in) instead of showing both sides. The other unbiased channels, or different informative websites show the positive side of the situation in question too. I don't want to get too detailed because like I said, I don't like arguing, and there are probably plenty of other similar instances out there.

But remember you do have a right to your opinion and it is just as valid as everyone else's opinion. Don't let anyone make you think otherwise.
Believe me the LAST thing I want to do is start an argument over anything! Ecspecially politics! Thank you for your thoughts and answers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Miss View Post
Ok first of all, no I do not think it is ok to be rude to someone about what they believe, that is silly and unnecessary and to be honest, its not actually going to convince someone to agree with you if you do that. I agree with Cassado in saying that I don't like arguing about these sorts of things, but really just because I don't know everything about the subject so there is no point.

It is great you have an opinion, but be willing to change your opinion because you never know, you might have got it wrong. Keep an open mind.

As for someone having a different opinion than yours, heck yes I think that it is perfectly fine to have a different opinion. No one has the same opinion as everyone else and that is perfectly fine. If no one had different opinions then the world wouldn't be any fun. However, I do not believe that it is ok to have an opinion that criticises another's existence or threatens someone's existence. Those types of opinions are not ok. They are hurtful and they are just generally not the right opinion to have anyway.

I don't really listen to the news and their views, I only really listen to the person themselves, and I don't really agree with Trumps views from what he has said not what others have said, so I really formed my own opinion about it. As I said before though, I don't care if someone has opposing opinions to me, that's fine as long as people don't attack each other for different views, which seems to be what a lot of people do.

Overall though, your family and friends making those comments would certainly not be nice, and in general they are hurtful and that's not ok. Its great you have different opinions to others, I know there are plenty of people that have the same opinion as you as well as people who have opposing opinions. I wouldn't really recommend trying to start an argument over it though because it really just isn't worth the time and effort.

Have fun anyway and good luck with other responses.
I validate everyone's opinions and I am respectful to them. But seems as if no one I know does the same. So that's why I thought I could be wrong.. Thank you for your thoughts and answers!
Quote:
Originally Posted by BDF View Post
Trump makes some good points and arguments... but nulls most of them by behaving almost like an emotional child in public, and also does make some very stupid points and argumets designed to appeal to a certain embittered and emotional % of the the public who only know how to react with outrage and hysteria to anything that isn't to their appetite. Oh don't get me wrong... I think there are a lot of people on the left side of politics who react similar, but I rarely see their mainstream politicians show the same colours, flinging arms around in front of cameras, pulling faces and deliberately talking in stupid voices.

And by "emotional child" I also mean things like the orangutan lawsuit... ffs. What demographic of the population would a politician launching a frivolous lawsuit like that appeal to? Are those are the kinds people he's trying to build a career on??? And that's the kind of example he wants to set??? Srsly??? I find it difficult to listen to him.

__________________________________________________ ____


BUT... about the other things you said... your family/friends hating on you. No it isn't right. My particular problem with Donald Trump is pretty much all that I've said above. I don't like his childish act, and I think they need to find someone better than him to represent them, and someone who will tone-it-down a bit too. Deporting migrants which have already been granted asylum is a very dishonest thing to do. It's going back on your word.

When younger, I have migrated (mostly with my mum) between countries for permanent residence about 6 or 7 times in my life. We had to put up occasionaly with assholes smashing our car because we were "foreign", spraying grafiti, and worse sometimes. I have never had much sympathy for far-right supporters, mostly no sympathy. I have learned to cope with people hating me. So has my mum. From that, you would assume I'd be on the left side of politics.

No.

I was on the left side for a while, and throughout secondary school years I started firmly believing
in "centre politics". Because: I have truly hated how I've seen people deamonized and called out as "racists" just for criticizing immigration, and silenced by things such as the threat of loosing their job because because of "bad PR". I hate hypocricy. I hate political correctness which has now been proven to undermine the justice system in the UK. A balanced political system means equality to both left and right, not biasing the culture in favor of one or the other. I hate "happy holidays" instead of "merry Christmas". I hate positive descrimination (equal opportunities start at pre-school, not in universities... but todlers don't vote for politicians and students do). And I hate the fucking dellusion some people have that racial minorities "can't be racist"...

... and I have seen recently that I am not the only one who hates all this. There are lots of people who hate it. But that does not mean I support "right wing" anything. It's like currency inflation, or grade inflation. Definitions change. With time, left-wing politics has inflated. What used to be regarded as "far-left", is now regarded as just "left-wing". What used to be "left-wing", became "centre", and what was "centre" became "right-wing".

And "right-wing" became "far-right-extremism", which makes me fucking laugh. ISIS is "far-right-extremism". Black Panthers, Westbro Baptist Church, Neo-NAZIs are forms of
"far-right-extremism". Not Donald Trump, or Nigel Farage... and definitely not David Cameron. I mean... if that's the case then jesus f christ was born from an easter egg.

This is exactly what I mean... people are trying to deamonize the opposing side in politics and compare people like Donald Trump, Nigel Farage... to Hitler, before they have even committed any kind of crime whatsoever. Ironically, many conflicts, fights and wars are started by people trying to prevent them... lashing out first with words, fists, or guns, in so called "self-defence".

If people keep alienating and profiling them as "far-right-extremists" instead of listening to what they have to say... then they and their supporters might just become exactly that. Same principle applies to Muslims, if you deamonize them, more of them will become extremists. Same principle applies to bringing up kids, where if you tell them that they are useless from a young age, they'll believe it, and become exactly that when they're older.

Same principle applies to almost any person alive, and what I can't stand is people who advertise themselves by virtue of their political inclinations as "open minded" and "tolerant", who at the same time spit venom and try to humiliate others for speaking against immigration, European Union, positive descrimination, etc. . Those people are not true liberals. They are nothing more than immature conformists and followers of a viral fucking pop-culture, without a shred of independent thinking or evidence of intelligence. They are making the problem of right-wing politics worse, not better. Of course this doesn't apply to all liberals, but I've seen and heard many like this. I don't know how many, but it could even be a majority (considering it is in many ways a pop-culture, that shouldn't be suprising).

So... don't let those people get inside your head. You should be proud that you're capable of thinking your own way and reaching your own conclusions, instead of just following media frenzies and crucifictions of people like Donald Sterling. You're not anything like Hitler (as hopefuly I've succesfuly explained using common sense). Otherwise, you have a lot of work to do to catch up to him.


.
Thank you!!! This really helped! I completely get what you've said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Proud90sKid View Post
I'll admit that I haven't been following politics at all. So I might be a bit uninformed- but I like Trump and as it is right now, I'd vote for him-definitely over Hilary.He has made some remarks that are shocking but I don't feel that it should prevent him from being president. The truth is that we as people discriminate against groups every single day- and only a few groups are so protected by political correctness. I don't think making a politically incorrect statement off the cuff should bar him from presidency. The guy is a billionaire - he gets to fund his own campaign and say what he wants to without worrying about losing his sponsors. And I respect that.

The thing is - is that he so far hasn't said anything too conservative (but again- I haven't been following). I'm not a conservative and I won't vote for someone who wants to restrict personal freedom (like many conservatives do). I'm more of a libertarian- at least when it comes to personal choices. I don't want to vote for a Bush or a Romney- I want more of a neutral candidate if I were to vote Republican. I feel that most conservative viewpoints are too old fashioned and that Republicans NEED a candidate with more neutral values if they expect to win a presidential election in modern times. Reagan and Bush values are so outdated.
Yes, I completely get what you've said and I agree! Politics has and always will be a BIG part of my life and my family. My dad is a libertarian and even though he might believe what some say are UnAmerican or nazi ideals, he's a good man and wants what's best for the country and for me to grow up in. So, I am stuck with politics ha Thanks for the thoughts!


Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future. ~Oscar Wilde.
   
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Tags
trump, world

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




All material copyright ©1998-2018, TeenHelp.
Terms | Legal | Privacy | Conduct | Complaints

Powered by vBulletin®.
Copyright ©2000-2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search engine optimization by vBSEO.
Theme developed in association with vBStyles.