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Religion and Spirituality, Science and Philosophy Use this forum to discuss what you believe in. This is a place where everyone may share their views freely.

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Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 04:33 AM

I have never been a super religious person. Today however I attended "Faith Day" (baseball game/christian rock concert) with a friend of mine after attending church. I stumbled through the morning thinking "well I get to see the game and spend time with my friend, maybe it won't be so bad." The Service was inspiring in comparison to previous church experiences and I was delighted to be having a pretty good day by the time the baseball game started. The concert was very good as well and the day was shaping up very nicely. (I'm a major music fan..all music) By the time I got home some minor descrepencies in my love life were wracking my brain and for some reason, maybe it was all the religion that surrounded me throughout the day, I decided to pull out the dusty old Bible on my shelf looking for some kind of insight. One verse that everyone knows by heart (even the biggest of athiests) is 1 Corinthians 13:4-7 thats the one that says love is patient love is kind...that one, so I turned to it and was skimming through thinking "hah.." but then I read the next one 13:8 "Love never fails." Those three words hit me like a ton of bricks. "Love never fails" its such a simple phrase and yet so vast, deep, and meaningful. Not only did it sooth my love life discomfort, but it also gave me hope that even in our darkest hour things can work out. It leaves me wondering, was it set out all along that I would go to "Faith Day", get out my Bible, and find a verse, a sign, that everything will work out?

So I'm gonna ask the obvious question does everything happen for a reason? (feel free to play devils advicate or chime in with simular stories!)


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 05:30 AM

You know what I think is most profound in the Bible? Unicorns. Psalm 22:21 KJV, "Save me from the lion’s mouth: for thou hast heard me from the horns of the unicorns."

As for everything happening for a reason. Think of the implications of such an idea. Your God, knowingly allows children to starve, women to be raped, men to killed horribly every single day because it is part of his plan for that to happen. It is also part of his plan that I shall be an atheist and therefore shall burn in hell.
   
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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 02:03 PM

I largely agree that it seems horrible to think all these bad things happen to people on perpose a perpose to teach people and grow people and make them stronger if not in faith then in themselves...but in the same breath isn't it harder to think they happen for no reason at all?


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August 20th 2012, 02:56 PM

Maeve, unicorn just means "one horn" and was probably used to describe a rino. More accurate translations actually say "the horn of the wild oxen".

As far as you going to Faith Day and reading your bible, yes, I absolutely see God working there and would say that He led it to happen. He wants you to know Him and wants to be your God and save you and some day bring you to Heaven- not for any reason other than His love for you. If you'd like to know Him and know why you need Him, feel free to send me a message or visit www.themostimportantthing.webs.com and click on "Why Do I Need Jesus?".

The "love never fails" verse has always amazed me too. It comforts me when I am worried or praying for something. The bible says that God is love. So, "love never fails" also means "God never fails". So, when I give my problems and worries over into God's hands, I can always trust that good will come of it because He never fails.

Oh, and as far as the bad things that happen and wheather or not they are for a reason...

Romans 8:28 says that "God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose." So all things, not just good things, are used for good. Now, the question is whether God made those things happen or whether He just didn't stop them from happening, I don't know the answer to that. I think it depends on the situation. I do believe though, that God knew they were going to happen and at least chose to let them happen. Not because He doesn't care, but because He is looking at the eternal good that comes out of things and not just the temporary good.

I kind of see it like a parent who takes their children to the doctor to get shots. They put them through that temporary pain because they know it will benefit them in the long run so they don't get sick. God does that too. He doesn't always stop the temporary trials and pains that we go through right away, because He is doing something for our more permanent well-being. Hebrews 12 talks about discipline (which means "training", not punishment) and how it isn't joyful while it's happening, but in the end produces righteousness. Read Hebrews 12, it's really good.

Last edited by LlamaLlamaDuck; August 24th 2012 at 10:29 PM. Reason: Merging posts.
   
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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 03:45 PM

Psychologically it is pretty nature to want to seek guidance from a higher power. Logically, if you were at a religious concert, it would seem to me natural of you to seek that guidance from the same religion. I am assuming you are an American, or in some country where Christianity is, more or less, one of the primary religions. If you were in India, perhaps you would have consulted the Rig-Veda, or in Afghanistan the Qur'an, or if in Israel the Torah. To say that you went home and read the bible after feeling down and attending a religious concert is, to me, no surprise. Religion appeals to your emotions. Love is an emotion. It then seems obvious that if you were surrounded by a religion appealing to an emotion that you were having complications with, that you would then seek guidance from that religion. Not only that the human mind is prone to deception. You would then like to FIND comfort in that religion, which is why your mind appealed to "love never fails," and explains why you came here to hear the answer, "Everything happens for a reason," which to that I can say with near certainty, nothing happens for a reason except the reasons we give it. So, the only reason any of this happened is because you chose for it to happen this way. Not because some mythological being was holding your hand and whispering in your ear to read your bible to come across the words, "Love never fails." Regardless, at least it comforted you, and that is never bad.

And if everything happens for a reason, you then have to account who or what causes everything, and that since the who or what causes everything, that that who or what also causes children to be molested, people to be murdered, genocides to happen, etc. Which then leaves the question, if everything happens for a reason, can anyone be held morally responsible apart from this thing causing them to do everything?
   
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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 04:01 PM

This is a tough one for me to answer. I don't even really view it from a completely religious standpoint, sometimes I just think that some things are meant to happen and form a chain of events that lead to something at the end of the road, even if those events leading up to that something at the end are bad.

For example: Growing up, from the time I started school to the end of middle school, I was bullied by everyone around me. Once I hit middle school, the bullying turned into straight beatings. Every single day, not one person had a kind word to say to me, and most days I'd end up being punched, or my head slammed into a locker, etc. Now, the school never did a damn thing about it, they just let it happen. I went through a major depression and constantly thought, "Why me?" It became so bad that after middle school, we moved far away, out into the country for me to start school with a new fresh start. Now I have so many incredible friends, my depression is gone, and I found the love of my life. So looking back, if I hadn't been bullied horribly for so long, we never would've moved and I never would've met the man I love. That's why sometimes I really believe things happen for a reason.


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 05:47 PM

i completely agree. I'm not a hardcore holy roller or anything but I do believe that you go left because if you went right you would have been hit by a bus or something. I feel like weather its a diety or the universe sometimes things happen the way they do for a reason.


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 20th 2012, 07:25 PM

Well, you turned to that verse because you knew it, and then found meaning in it. This is not, in my opinion, unbelievable enough to suggest any form of reason for anything in any way. I mean, it's a coincidence. The chances of it happening may be small, but even something with a small chance of happening is almost certain to happen given enough time - it'd be odd if something like that DIDN'T happen at least once, in fact.
So my short answer is: no. There is no reason.


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 22nd 2012, 05:00 AM

Short answer: No. Also, not everything needs a cause either.
   
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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 22nd 2012, 06:54 AM

Well, there is nothing at all suggesting this whatsoever.
If you can show anyone that there is, go right ahead.


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 22nd 2012, 08:45 AM

I view it as a series of events, some of which you planned, others which you didn't plan. The theme throughout the day was Christianity: the service, the concert and the passage. The source to consult for all this would be the Bible, so naturally you did and coincidentally stumbled upon a passage you connected with. It's a reasonable conclusion to delude yourself into but not one that applies to reality nor is there anything that occurred throughout the day to support it.


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 23rd 2012, 03:51 PM

Cause and effect. That's all it is.


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Re: Everything happens for a reason? - August 23rd 2012, 05:17 PM

Why did you write the first post in that colour? It hurt my eyes.


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