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"Medical conditions" - May 12th 2013, 12:31 PM

This thread has been labeled as triggering, particularly on the subject of eating disorders, by the original poster or by a Moderator. The contents of this thread might therefore not be suitable for certain sensitive users. Please take this into consideration before continuing to read.

Some people who are overweight or underweight, have genuine medical conditions. Fine.

In fact, if you broaden net, you could say that across the whole population, SOME people have genuine medical conditions, of whatever sort, by no means necessarily resulting in weight problems, but other problems too, such as stunted growth, poor eyesight, etc.


But I have to ask then, focusing on the overweight/underweight problem... how come more people have these "medical conditions" in countries such as the USA and UK, than in countries such as Germany, Italy, Brazil, Japan? These "medical conditions", which apparently deny them the ability to live a healthy lifestyle?

Like I said, some people have genuine medical conditions. Some. But I've travelled a lot and have known plenty of people from all backgrounds, and I've started thinking quite some time ago that a lot of people who might be obese, just blame their obesity on a "medical condition". That's right. Job done, "not my fault" sort of attitude.


My main point, is pointing out the facts. Judge for yourselves. How come more people have these "medical conditions" in countries such as the USA and UK, than in countries such as Germany, Italy, Brazil, Japan?


http://www.fitnessblender.com/v/arti...or-Obesity/82/



(yes, I'm hinting that a large amount of "medical conditions" may either be phony, or just used as an excuse to shift the blame on something that apparently nothing can be done about anyway. Basically, just excuses. Excuses such as:
a) bad knee (I've had accidents sabotaging both my knees, especially my left, and still have problems)
b) bad back (also had my back somewhat sabotaged in an accident)
c) bad stomach (who doesn't have a bad stomach occasionally... and who wouldn't have a bad stomach from over-eating or under-eating?)
d) hay fever during spring/summer months (I have it myself, I'm in perfect shape regardless)
e) slow metabolism (if you don't exercise or move much... of course you'l have "slow metabolism")
f) "gland problems" - so vague that I can't even comment. It's like people skiving off work because of "family problems"


g) fill in as many as you can think of....





I'm sure some people will respond to this thread, quoting examples of their medical conditions. It almost always happens in any forum. Don't come here trying to prove anything to anyone. If you personally aren't happy with yourself, ask yourself why? Because usually, the answer is because you yourself haven't done enough to change it (perhaps by blaming it on other things). I know that if I feel like I haven't done enough to change something that matters to me, then I feel crap. This applies to anything, grades, whatever skills I've got, fitness goals, whatever I might find unacceptable enough to intervene in (rare)).

If you are happy with yourself then great. You don't need to change anything, overweight or not. But you yourself know best if you're happy or not with whatever, in this case, health.



Just look at the Paralympics for inspiration. Most of those contestants have far more genuine excuses that they could use for neglecting their health. But they don't do it. They get on with shit and deal with it.




.


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Then politics doesn't care about you either. Truth. You've got to make your voice heard, if you want to be listened to. But that's too logical for some people, so let me go a step further. Not making your voice heard, leaves other people free to hijack it by speaking on your behalf, even if they don't actually give a shit about you. That's politics. So, make your voice heard. That's not a quote from anywhere. That's just me.



Last edited by Kitty.; May 15th 2013 at 02:03 AM.
   
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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 12th 2013, 09:38 PM

Just the life styles, IMO. People in the United States has a higher calorie intake on average then most countries; Say in Japan, they eat a more fish / rice diet compared to the American diets.

Also with the Medical condition, its just the "dumbing down" of Society, a Society where its not your fault and everyone wins. No one wants to take responsibility for their actions, whether it be for a simple crime or picking up a spoon too damn much.


   
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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 12th 2013, 09:47 PM

I'm over-weight because I over-eat, very simply, and being over-weight puts me at risk of developing a large amount of medical conditions, such as heart disease and type 2 diabetes. Whose responsibility is it to change this? My own.

I know a lot of depressed people will emotionally eat which causes weight gain, but once the depression has been addressed, they are generally able to lose the weight.
I know certain body types are simply heavier. I know certain ethnicities are at higher risk of developing certain diseases.

I also know that in the end, unless you have something like a thyroid malfunction, or some sort of injury or illness that prevents you from eating right and exercising, then being healthy is a choice that must be made by the individual.

My country (NZ) is currently talking about facing an "obesity epidemic". Instead of trying to find a medical answer as to why, things like introducing more exercise options for young people and encouraging healthier choices are being done. We have an ad on TV that basically says to parents "if your kids are thirsty, offer them water or milk".

Yeah there are people with genuine medical conditions. But I think if we look at overweight and obese people as a general big picture, we'll find that the reason people are fat is because they make unhealthy choices.
   
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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 12th 2013, 10:04 PM

I'm one of those people that has a thyroid condition, and on top of that PCOS and Insulin Resistance that was genetic (not brought on by weight.. which is rare, but happens.. I literally have had it since the day I was born.) So most my life, I was obese. Not so much anymore, though..

There are people with real medical problems, whether they be genetic, or brought on by the weight, that make it difficult to lose weight.

But.. if you're determined to lose the weight, you in almost all cases can lose the weight. People need to take ownership of their decisions, and once they can do that, they can get the help they need to lose weight..

Once I got all of my health conditions controlled with medications and I had some tests done to figure out what my resting calorie count was (basically tells you how fast/slow your metabolism is.. mine is very slow, shocker.) You know what you need to do diet/exercise wise to counter it and lose the weight.. which I have.

I was one of those people that always claimed that health conditions prevented me from losing weight, but alas, I was looking for an easy way out.. I've worked my ass off the past couple years, and lost 1/3 of my original body weight.. My blood work is perfect for the first time in my life(with the help of the medications, of course), and I'm still losing.

Anyone who says they can't, just aren't really ready to properly try yet.

You have to be in the right mind-set to be able to accomplish anything.. weight loss, included. Once you get any outside factors (mental health, anything genetic that could possibly be making WL difficult, etc..) controlled, it comes down to pure determination and how badly you want to be healthy.


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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 12th 2013, 10:04 PM

I believe it is a combination of lifestyle and diet. In the more western countries (USA and the UK) the majority of the population no longer needs to hunt or gather food, yet our bodies were designed to be hunters and gatherers. In this sense our bodies will store fat for periods where we fail to gather or hunt food (such as in winter when food is scarce), unfourtunately food is never scarce for most people in western civilizations and as such they store food that they never use resulting in obesity.
There's also diet, there's a study in China that is being conducted where they monitor a population for health conditions (such as obesity, cancer, diabetes, etc.) while they still eat an "eastern" diet, and then check the population in the same region after urbanization and a change to a more "western" diet. Western diets are higher in proteins, animal fats, and chemicals while other diets are more fruits/vegetables/fish. In these studies they found that the amount of health conditions went way up after a change in diet, while I'm not entirely convinced that is entirely because of the diet or the change in amount of pollution and chemicals in an urbanized environment there is still a definite correlation.

In short I believe these "medical conditions" you're referring to are a result of a less active lifestyle and a diet high in animal fats and larger portions. Our bodies were just not designed to live like this and this is the result.


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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 12th 2013, 10:06 PM

Being overweight can cause a lot of these medical conditions in the first place. In my case, depression and anxiety. That is one of the contributing factors to my 'underlying illnesses' and when trying to address the extra weight I find it hard to get motivated or to find the confidence to go to the gym and exercise in front of people. And then because I can't shift the weight it goes around in a big circle.

Another condition, pcos, can make it extremely hard for women to lose weight - however having a high bmi in the first place increases the risk of the disease occuring. As someone diagnosed with this, I did intensive gym sessions for 4 times a week for 3 months and saw no weightloss whatsoever. So my point is, once you're stuck in the rut, it's pretty hard to get back out.




   
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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 13th 2013, 08:17 AM

Hey,

This thread doesn't really contain much things to debate or anything about current worldwide news so im going to go ahead and move it to a better forum


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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 14th 2013, 05:56 PM

Pish-posh.

"Medical condition" only applies to some, not all. My family has bad thyroid problems, and a lot of them have lost weight and furthermore kept it off, despite the fact that it does slow their metabolism. Plenty of other disorders are the same way: With diligence and hard work, you reap the reward of a healthy body and mind.

I've met a lot a people who have "medical conditions," who are obviously very overweight and doing nothing about it. That isn't a medical condition: That's laziness. My family has a lot of overweight people in it, and I've been told that being overweight is a genetic thing in our family, and that I'm destined to have the same medical conditions as all of them because of their genetics. I don't believe a word of it: The fact that my entire family has sausage and eggs and a stack of pancakes every morning contributes to it.

It makes me a little angry when people say being unhealthy is genetic or a medical condition, because in most cases -- unless they are really, truly physically unable to move -- it's just lack of exercise and a truckload of sweets that's doing it to them.


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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 14th 2013, 07:05 PM

I have family members that have high blood pressure, deficiencies in vitamins and autoimmune deficiencies/diseases.
The high blood pressure is due to the fact a majority of my family put way more salt than is necessary on and cook it in their foods (along with a lot of other unhealthy choices). The vitamin deficiencies are due to them not eating the foods that they should be to make their bodies healthy. And the autoimmune diseases/deficiencies/illnesses are caused by both genetic predispositions that are triggered due to stress (mostly self-imposed), diet, lifestyle and the unwillingness to make changes in eating habits. Another problem is people do not always follow their doctors advice, as in if they are given medicine, they do not take it as prescribed or at all because they think they do not need it or do not want to put up with the side-effects which, if they told their doctor about, they may be able to get help for or change medicines to avoid such problems. Also people do not take the medicines due to cost, another huge problem is how pharmasutical companies charge a whole lot for medication and testing, people cannot afford the treatment they need and may not have insurance to cover it.
Here is an example of one of my family members:
They have four or so autoimmune diseases (sclariderma, lupus, diegos and another two that I am unable to spell let alone pronounce). They were doing very porrly at one point, had to be hospitalized and over time by making positive life decisions and taking medicines to help with their disorders, the disorders have gone into remission for the most part. They have to take medicines everyday, watch what they eat etc. but now they are doing well, able to go places (they were at a point where they couldn't move their hands) and they are able to function properly.
A lot of this has to do with wanting to make decisions to improve health and even though it is really hard, not giving up on trying, all of the hard work pays off in the end.


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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 14th 2013, 07:26 PM

There are people with genuine medical conditions like thyroid issues or those who need medication that causes weight gain so they have less control over it. However, that does NOT excuse you from trying to take care of yourself and changing the things you can control. My grandmother for example, is obese, diabetic and has high blood pressure and high cholesterol. She absolutely REFUSES to do things that she should be doing to change things because she's convinced it's a "medical condition" I can put that in quotes because doctors have never been able to identify a reason, other than arthritis and a bad back, that she couldn't change it if she wanted to and those things can be worked around and would get better if she lost weight.

I find it annoying when an overweight person is confronted and they immediately say that it's caused by a medical condition when in reality most of the time it's not, or once the condition is treated, the weight takes care of itself.


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Re: "Medical conditions" - May 15th 2013, 04:56 PM

You people here are great. It's refreshing to hear some sense.


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Originally Posted by Music View Post
In short I believe these "medical conditions" you're referring to are a result of a less active lifestyle and a diet high in animal fats and larger portions. Our bodies were just not designed to live like this and this is the result.
That's a common argument, and it's a good one. But I was having a conversation with someone today about a totally different topic... it was about some mice chewing the rubber off around our fridge door in our previous house. It usually happened when we'd be gone for over a week. Yes, the mice somehow sensed (smelt perhaps?) that there was food in the fridge, and wanted to get to it. He proposed, leaving some food out intentionally, to act as a "distraction" for the mice, so that they don't resort to chewing through the fridge door.

The problem is, mice are stupid. Most animals are. You'd have to leave an extremely unreasonably large block of cheese for the mice to "have enough". Why? Because they're stupid. They don't have the self awareness that people have. They wouldn't ration the food. They'd eat and finish it all in a day if they could, and leave themselves nothing for the rest of the week, and then die of starvation or resort to chewing the fridge door again. Or even more dramatically, die of over-eating (I doubt it though). And if they didn't die of starvation, because you'd keep supplying them with extra food, they'd just keep eating, and keep eating until they'd themselves become morbidly obese probably. They are animals which act on survival instincts, which are to eat and reproduce and occasionally fight.

Even take a more intelligent animal, like a cat or a dog. I don't see them usually eating and eating and eating and doing nothing else. They walk away from the food bowl usually once they've had enough. But I doubt most of these animals would be intelligent enough to see the correlation between overeating and weight gain.

People are supposed to be more intelligent. We've evolved. We understand, that if we eat everything we have in the fridge too fast, then we won't have any left next day... and that doing so consistently will lead to health problems. It can lead to breaking the bank, or more likely, weight gain. Not many people are so poor in Western countries that they can't afford food. I'm not calling those who do over-eat stupid. They just have other problems that need addressing, and most frequently it's the denial/blame game, which applies to being overweight/underweight, but also to many other things in life. Even things like someone not having a job. They'd rather blame the immigrants than see that it's because they failed all their exams at school and stink of alcohol during the job interview.


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Originally Posted by Illuminate View Post
Being overweight can cause a lot of these medical conditions in the first place. In my case, depression and anxiety. That is one of the contributing factors to my 'underlying illnesses' and when trying to address the extra weight I find it hard to get motivated or to find the confidence to go to the gym and exercise in front of people. And then because I can't shift the weight it goes around in a big circle.

Another condition, pcos, can make it extremely hard for women to lose weight - however having a high bmi in the first place increases the risk of the disease occuring. As someone diagnosed with this, I did intensive gym sessions for 4 times a week for 3 months and saw no weightloss whatsoever. So my point is, once you're stuck in the rut, it's pretty hard to get back out.
If there is a genuine health disorder which directly impacts someone's BMI, then it's a more complicated issue that usually can't be simply addressed by becoming fanatical about the gym, and spending even 3 or 4 hours a day in it. It can in fact be damaging.

The most common mistake people who are trying to loose weight make, is that they either go on a "healthy diet", and do almost no additional exercise... or they do plenty of exercise, but don't change their diet. This doesn't even have anything to do with whatever health conditions. People need to do both, change their diet, and exercise.

Really, the best thing for people with genuine health disorders to do, is consult with a nutritionist/personal trainer. It may even require medical tests to be done to figure out how the health disorder affects specifically that person. I don't know enough about these specialist things to give any advice on it.


If you find it difficult to show up at the gym in front of other people, well, just do it at home. There's probably a lot less "specialist equipment", but it's not a big problem. One of the most effective calorie burning exercises are squats, even without any weights. They work your biggest muscles (legs and back), and doing them fast enough can be as tiring as jogging on a treadmill. You don't need to do them fast, just do them at a pace which suits you. It's better to carry on for longer, than to exhaust yourself in 5 minutes. They sound simple, and they are, but I'd recommend watching some proper videos on youtube to see how they should be done, so that you reap the full benefits. Most beginners to dumb things like balancing on their toes, or leaning forward too much, which makes it feel like you're moving a lot when you're not.

Sometimes I find it too boring to get myself to do physical exercise, which just involves repeating the same movement over, and over. Sometimes it's a motivational problem, I just can't be f/ed. I feel tired at the thought of it, even though I might have had a full night's sleep and had all the food and water I need to function properly. What works for me, is playing some music that I like, or even just turning the TV onto some channel. It draws my attention away from thinking how tired and bored I am, and helps me to get down to doing some exercise.


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Then politics doesn't care about you either. Truth. You've got to make your voice heard, if you want to be listened to. But that's too logical for some people, so let me go a step further. Not making your voice heard, leaves other people free to hijack it by speaking on your behalf, even if they don't actually give a shit about you. That's politics. So, make your voice heard. That's not a quote from anywhere. That's just me.


   
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