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I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 10:36 AM

This thread has been labeled as containing spoilers. The contents of this thread might therefore describe important elements of a storyline that could ruin it for you. Please take this into consideration before continuing to read.

So, Bella get's pregnant in the final book/film. How on earth has Edward got living sperm?


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 11:43 AM

That's what I hated about Breaking Dawn When Bella realises she's pregnant, she says the male reproductive system continues to function throughout a man's life. (I'm not going to search for a quote from the book, it's 700 pages long...)

What I couldn't get my head around was how Edward could get a hard-on if he has no pulse and no blood.




   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 12:17 PM

Exactly blood = erection :|

I'm not going to even question some of the other parts of the book. It's confusing.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 12:31 PM

Lol. This question amused me xD

It's a fantasy novel, it doesn't have to make sense. Why are you not questioning the fact that the vampires SPARKLE in sunlight when they're supposed to melt? xD
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 01:08 PM

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Originally Posted by Capt'n Cara View Post
Lol. This question amused me xD

It's a fantasy novel, it doesn't have to make sense. Why are you not questioning the fact that the vampires SPARKLE in sunlight when they're supposed to melt? xD
I thought they burned up?
Yeah, that's the problem with fantasy, the writers can just make up whatever they want really, and change the lore of different creatures to fit in better with their stories. I guess you either have to believe all of it, to make the story flow, or none of it, and call bulls*** xD


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 01:38 PM

To be very honest I have never been a fan of twilight simply for its lack of substance. There are a lot of changes to the lore which in ways can be good to bring along changes within the genre but Meyer shows an almost complete disregard for the whole lore.
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 11:33 PM

Trying to count the flaws and so-called 'inaccuracies' in Twilight is like trying to count the number of stars in the sky. You can't. So give up.
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 6th 2011, 11:59 PM

Yeah. It really didn't make much sense. But Twilight itself doesn't really make much sense. The last book seemed more like a fan-fiction than a proper fantasy novel to me. It was too unrealistic, and there was barely any conflict. A very disappointing read.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 7th 2011, 01:46 PM

Apparently Stephenie Meyer has a degree in English Literature O____O


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 8th 2011, 11:51 AM

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Originally Posted by Gaia View Post


I thought they burned up?
Yeah, that's the problem with fantasy, the writers can just make up whatever they want really, and change the lore of different creatures to fit in better with their stories. I guess you either have to believe all of it, to make the story flow, or none of it, and call bulls*** xD
Uhm. How do you think the "correct" view of creatures happened? Via stories.

I thought the books weren't bad at all, but I was also younger when I read them. I'd like to see any of you make a better series. You can make anything happen in a fantasy world, but you have to create limitations or the story doesn't work. I agree, perhaps Stephanie Myer could have had some stronger limitations but it IS hard to create such a large story.

I feel like they explained the OP's question at some point, but I'm not sure.



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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 8th 2011, 08:46 PM

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Uhm. How do you think the "correct" view of creatures happened? Via stories.

I thought the books weren't bad at all, but I was also younger when I read them. I'd like to see any of you make a better series. You can make anything happen in a fantasy world, but you have to create limitations or the story doesn't work. I agree, perhaps Stephanie Myer could have had some stronger limitations but it IS hard to create such a large story.

I feel like they explained the OP's question at some point, but I'm not sure.
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 8th 2011, 09:31 PM

Is it sad that the last book was actually my favorite...?
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 8th 2011, 09:38 PM

well it's the funniest, at least...

It's like how they don't need to breath... or sleep... or eat very often... she should've done some study into biology, then the books wouldn't be so irritatingly impossible


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 10th 2011, 06:07 PM

DUH! It's Jacob's




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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 10th 2011, 11:03 PM

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DUH! It's Jacob's
Yes so the werewolf fathered his own future lover?
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 10th 2011, 11:09 PM

um i think you have this question under the wrong section..... i mean you put a twilight question under the literature section ...


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 11th 2011, 11:05 AM

Good question. I never thought about this before, mainly cause I don't think about Twilight


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 11th 2011, 01:28 PM

This never crossed my mind :P I used to <3 the books and now I hate them but this has inspired me to read them again tee hee that's awesome!


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 11th 2011, 04:51 PM

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Yes so the werewolf fathered his own future lover?
Well the book already includes pedophilia, bestiality, spousal abuse, etc., as being perfectly acceptable and lyk totes awsum. So...incest actually wouldn't be that much of a stretch.

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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 11th 2011, 05:21 PM

Yeah, um, I'm guessing it's because he doesn't need to grow at all to do something most guys do? but a girl has to grow fat and the fetus then grows and yeah. Some vampires theorists believe differently about it, but some do this vampires have blood it is just mutated rather than being completely drained of it. they need the blood to refresh their bodies instead. so this sperm thing, i've got no clue.
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 11th 2011, 09:08 PM

Or maybe it was like an imaculate conception type deal?


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 12th 2011, 09:29 AM

It's poor writing and thought, that's all.

It would be okay except that Mrs. Meyer keeps spouting these 'scientific' explanations as to how things work but obviously has no grasp of biology and how things are supposed to work.

The books have so many plotholes, fallacies and anachronisms that honestly, if you're going to read them, your sense of disbelief better be caged at the ends of the earth, otherwise you won't be able to read it and keep a straight face.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 12th 2011, 10:03 AM

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Originally Posted by Sapphire_Wings View Post
Yes so the werewolf fathered his own future lover?
I don't get it. Is he a pedo or does he just wait 20 years or so?


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 12th 2011, 10:33 AM

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I don't get it. Is he a pedo or does he just wait 20 years or so?
He only has to wait seven years because Renesmee has 'accelerated growth' (lol, must be all the VGH - Vampire growth hormone) until she's an adult.
But really what it sounds like is child grooming which is illegal in most countries...

Imprinting cross species on a vampire/human hybrid who is most probably sterile? Not the greatest evolutionary tactic, I'm sure.


There is also the whole genetics issue because humans have 46 Chromosomes in 23 pairs. According to Meyer, Vampires have 50 chromosomes in 25 pairs.
Her theory is that four human chromosomes (two pairs) split in half, giving two extra pairs.
This is quite a flawed theory as chromosomes simply are bundles of genetic material (that are only present when cell replication occurs, otherwise DNA just hangs around as chromatin and just chills in a tangle) and if you slice one in half, all the material is still there and your DNA remains the same and as for doubling it? No difference in genetic structure, there's just more of the same genes...Edit: That's wrong, it doesn't even double. It's like having an apple, cutting it is half and saying, 'I had one piece of apple, now I have two pieces of apple.' That's true... but you still only have a grand total of one apple. So yes, now you have extra chromasomes... but no extra DNA, good job.
The only issue is in reproduction because your chromosomes in gametes are spliced randomly meaning that you end up with four eggs/sperm with less/more genetic material leading to birth defects (such as Downs, Patau and Edwards trisomies) and probable death for the baby. Hence why vampires should be sterile...
It also seems that Meyer assumes that both chromosomes in a pair are the SAME... which is a huge no-no, I mean, how pointless would that be...

But back to Renesmee... Bella is human so she has 46 chromosomes and her eggs would all have 23 unpaired chromosomes.
Edward is a vampire, he has 50 chromosomes so his supernatural sperm (Assuming the mutation in his DNA happened in his reproductive organs and affected gametogenesis, otherwise he'd have normal, human babies) would have 25 chromosomes.
Bella egg + Edward sperm = 48 Chromosomes, some of which were Edward's doubled up genetic material, should lead to her being either a normal human baby or a seriously deformed human baby. My bad, Eddikins dousn't have doubled up material and hence, she'd just be deformed due to the fact that she'll be missing a chromosome worth of genetic material.

That is just a small sample of why you don't pretend to know how genetics works without RESEARCH.

And there are lots of other erroneous scientific explanations that Meyer keeps spouting but I'm going to save them for another day.
Lesson: Meyer, just say it's magic, people will believe you and it makes you sound more credible than spouting rubbish that is obviously wrong.



On vampiric erections: Meyer said that vamires are unchanged from the moment they are turned (apart from healing of wounds and illness). I'm guessing Edward dearest had a hard-on when Carlisle turned him. I mean, an erection isn't counted as an injury. Maybe that's why Edward is so angsty? I mean, I feel sorry for anyone who has a 100 year long hard-on, that's got to be some pretty bad frustration/embarrassment. But then again, you'd never need viagra...


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 13th 2011, 01:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleMiss View Post
He only has to wait seven years because Renesmee has 'accelerated growth' (lol, must be all the VGH - Vampire growth hormone) until she's an adult.
But really what it sounds like is child grooming which is illegal in most countries...

Imprinting cross species on a vampire/human hybrid who is most probably sterile? Not the greatest evolutionary tactic, I'm sure.


There is also the whole genetics issue because humans have 46 Chromosomes in 23 pairs. According to Meyer, Vampires have 50 chromosomes in 25 pairs.
Her theory is that four human chromosomes (two pairs) split in half, giving two extra pairs.
This is quite a flawed theory as chromosomes simply are bundles of genetic material (that are only present when cell replication occurs, otherwise DNA just hangs around as chromatin and just chills in a tangle) and if you slice one in half, all the material is still there and your DNA remains the same and as for doubling it? No difference in genetic structure, there's just more of the same genes...Edit: That's wrong, it doesn't even double. It's like having an apple, cutting it is half and saying, 'I had one piece of apple, now I have two pieces of apple.' That's true... but you still only have a grand total of one apple. So yes, now you have extra chromasomes... but no extra DNA, good job.
The only issue is in reproduction because your chromosomes in gametes are spliced randomly meaning that you end up with four eggs/sperm with less/more genetic material leading to birth defects (such as Downs, Patau and Edwards trisomies) and probable death for the baby. Hence why vampires should be sterile...
It also seems that Meyer assumes that both chromosomes in a pair are the SAME... which is a huge no-no, I mean, how pointless would that be...

But back to Renesmee... Bella is human so she has 46 chromosomes and her eggs would all have 23 unpaired chromosomes.
Edward is a vampire, he has 50 chromosomes so his supernatural sperm (Assuming the mutation in his DNA happened in his reproductive organs and affected gametogenesis, otherwise he'd have normal, human babies) would have 25 chromosomes.
Bella egg + Edward sperm = 48 Chromosomes, some of which were Edward's doubled up genetic material, should lead to her being either a normal human baby or a seriously deformed human baby. My bad, Eddikins dousn't have doubled up material and hence, she'd just be deformed due to the fact that she'll be missing a chromosome worth of genetic material.

That is just a small sample of why you don't pretend to know how genetics works without RESEARCH.

And there are lots of other erroneous scientific explanations that Meyer keeps spouting but I'm going to save them for another day.
Lesson: Meyer, just say it's magic, people will believe you and it makes you sound more credible than spouting rubbish that is obviously wrong.



On vampiric erections: Meyer said that vamires are unchanged from the moment they are turned (apart from healing of wounds and illness). I'm guessing Edward dearest had a hard-on when Carlisle turned him. I mean, an erection isn't counted as an injury. Maybe that's why Edward is so angsty? I mean, I feel sorry for anyone who has a 100 year long hard-on, that's got to be some pretty bad frustration/embarrassment. But then again, you'd never need viagra...
Haha, thanks, you know your Twilight . Really quite disturbing that he's dating a 7 year old despite the 'age up'.

The last bit made me LOL.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 14th 2011, 03:46 AM

Let me explain something about normal male sperm: they don't die. Sperm will keep reproducing for a man's entire life.Technically, he's dead. But he's not dead.He's just not alive in a human sense. His body, being a male body, will continue to produce sperm just like a human male. If you really read the book, vampires, in her view, are very capable of having sex. Their bodies freeze but their hormones do not. Sex is even more intense for them then it is for humans. It's pleasureful and all that they want for a few years after they find a mate. The males can produce sperm, just like an 90 year old human male can. It's actually not that out there. Doesn't mean the book isn't complete insanity, but that's what makes it such a good read. It's so bad in places that it's good.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 14th 2011, 04:55 AM

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Let me explain something about normal male sperm: they don't die. Sperm will keep reproducing for a man's entire life.Technically, he's dead. But he's not dead.He's just not alive in a human sense. His body, being a male body, will continue to produce sperm just like a human male. If you really read the book, vampires, in her view, are very capable of having sex. Their bodies freeze but their hormones do not. Sex is even more intense for them then it is for humans. It's pleasureful and all that they want for a few years after they find a mate. The males can produce sperm, just like an 90 year old human male can. It's actually not that out there. Doesn't mean the book isn't complete insanity, but that's what makes it such a good read. It's so bad in places that it's good.
Okay, so, vampire women can't have children because their cells are frozen and they can't mature eggs/their bodies don't change (because their cells don't divide)?
But sperm are produced via spermatogenesis which is from cells dividing - which Meyer pretty much says doesn't happen. So technically they should be infertile. If she'd known anything about biology, she could have realised her mistake instead of trying to cover it up with lashings of pseudoscientific babble.

Plus, sperm are very fussy about temperature, human sperm only tolerate temperature differences of less than 5C. So if Edward's sperm is at those cooler temperatures, they would die or at least be 'asleep' as they wouldn't have the energy to swim anywhere, plus they need to be heated slowly and gently to body temp. However, if he had super vampire sperm that was used to his body temperature, entering Bella's warm body would kill them too.

The point wasn't whether he can father a baby, but how does he get an erection. Women vamps can't get pregnant because their uteruses don't change, so why should Edward's joystick be able to 'get hard' (even though if it was as hard as the rest of his body, it already would be)?
You could say the the venom acts like blood but he still doesn't have a heart beat... So the only conclusion is that he has a permanent erection.

I have another question...
Vampires don't poop or pee and they don't sweat, so where does the blood that they drink go? And blood isn't like water, it has lots of proteins and cells in it, so once digested, you'd actually end up with quite a bit of solid material...
Unless they just regurgitate it later like they do human food, but that'd be a bit weird.
And where does all the water go? I mean, blood contains quite a bit of water too so, where does it go? Why aren't vamps like big blimps full of water and solid bits? Why don't they explode after a couple of years and a few hundred gallons of blood?
Man, that's gotta be some pretty nasty constipation...


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 14th 2011, 05:30 AM

He's Edward, which means he's like totally magical!!! *Acts like obsessed fan girl*

I honestly don't know... Stephanie should've studied a bit more biology before hand, but whatever, it is a fantasy book.
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 14th 2011, 05:36 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprinklez View Post
He's Edward, which means he's like totally magical!!! *Acts like obsessed fan girl*

I honestly don't know... Stephanie should've studied a bit more biology before hand, but whatever, it is a fantasy book.
I'd be perfectly satisfied if Meyer had said 'It's magic, okay?'

But she goes on and on about the scientific aspects and it's pretty clear she doesn't know very much about biology. Which makes her look kind of stupid.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 14th 2011, 08:57 PM

I think this is all just far too much time to be spent thinking about the series. You read Twilight, eventually you get over it, and then you start realising all this stuff. By this point I'd just stopped caring about whatever came out of Meyer, sensical or otherwise...

But I think LittleMiss has provided the best biological explanation to the erection. It also accounts for his erratic and dramatic mood. The idea is that you do like Bella and just don't think too hard, nor pay attention in biology class (though I do seem to remember she was on some special advanced course before she went to Forks? )

Maybe we're all just too human

One thing though. Twilight isn't a fantasy. It's a dark romance. Apparently.
(If by dark they mean it includes abuse, undiagnosed depression, attempted suicide, narccisism, paedophilia, cross-breeding, arguably both necrophilia and beastiality, emotional blackmail and at the end of it all a big OK from the author...yeah, that's pretty dark. Except when it's in sunlight. Then it's SPARKLY )

And I just ended every paragraph with a smiley face


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 15th 2011, 09:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by razors_and_rosary View Post
If by dark they mean it includes abuse, undiagnosed depression, attempted suicide, narccisism, paedophilia, cross-breeding, arguably both necrophilia and beastiality, emotional blackmail and at the end of it all a big OK from the author...yeah, that's pretty dark. Except when it's in sunlight. Then it's SPARKLY
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 27th 2011, 02:55 AM

Hahaha, I just took the time to read through all of these comments.
Made my entire month pretty much. <3

You guys are awesome, haha.


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 30th 2011, 12:58 PM

Lol this question and the comments made me laugh
I've never really understood Twilight, you can pick out so many flaws in it :/


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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - June 30th 2011, 02:01 PM

However anyone wants to twist this it is quite impossible. Although maybe in Meyers world Carlos the magical doctor has made vampire viagra.
   
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Re: I need to ask a question about Twilight - July 1st 2011, 10:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sapphire_Wings View Post
Yes so the werewolf fathered his own future lover?


Well, it's already an inaccurate book So why not?




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