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Technology and Gaming This forum is for discussions about your hardware, software, game or anything Web-related.

View Poll Results: Mac vs PC
Mac 15 41.67%
PC 21 58.33%
Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

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  (#1 (permalink)) Old
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Mac vs PC - May 2nd 2010, 03:43 PM

I will be starting university in the Fall and I'm looking to get a new laptop. Keep in mind, I will be living in residence. I've been having trouble deciding between a Mac and a PC so any opinions would be appreciated.

What I do on the computer:

- Internet (Facebook, forums, etc.)
- MS Office (reports, presentations, etc.)
- MSN/instant messengers
- Watch movies
- Listen to music
- Download
- Play minor games (i.e., Sims 3) --> very rarely
- PhotoShop --> rarely

What I am looking for in a computer:

- I'd like it to be portable since I'll be a university student and will probably have to take it places
- Relatively long battery life. The laptop I have now has like a two hour battery life so I just keep it plugged in all the time.
- Nice to look at. I hate the look of Lenovos and other ugly computers.
- Will last a long time (3 years?)

__

1) Mac or PC?

2) If Mac, based on my needs, would you get a 13" or a 15"?

Re: 13" vs 15", people are saying to get the 15" because of the new i5 processors that were put in vs. the C2Ds that are still in the 13". Thing is, the 15" is like $700 more than the 13" --> plus, the 13" is more portable and has a longer battery life.


Thoughts/opinions/suggestions?

Thanks


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 2nd 2010, 05:15 PM

Cannot advise that you buy a Mac, PC's are just so much cheaper and fill your needs better.

Also, i5 vs C2D isn't really important if you're not pushing the PC! Any decent laptop should be able to run Sims 3.
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 02:39 PM

I've had PC's for years and finally got a Mac last year and i can't believe i didn't get one sooner. In my opinion they're much better than PCs, so much easier to use - quicker and they look better..


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 05:53 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elle. View Post
I've had PC's for years and finally got a Mac last year and i can't believe i didn't get one sooner. In my opinion they're much better than PCs, so much easier to use - quicker and they look better..
And they cost literally twice as much. Frankly for what the OP uses it for she's not going to see enough of a difference for it to be worth it imo
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 06:25 PM

If you're looking for a simple, no-nonsense computer that just works, go for the Mac. For most people 13" is more than enough and for your use the Core 2 Duo in the 13" MacBook Pro is amazing. It looks great and has a beautiful screen, with the unibody case it's also extremely strong and durable. If you want a guarantee that it lasts three years, you should probably get the AppleCare warranty thing =)

[on an off-topic sidenote: Sorry Rob, just couldn't resist...]


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 07:17 PM

Macs are more efficient.

I think there are less crashes as well? Should've gotten a Mac myself.


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 07:18 PM

I am a college student and I have a 13 inch mac and I LOVE it. I LOVE IT! Yes, it was expensive but 2 years later it runs the same as the day I took it out of the box. It also has a longer life expectancy than a PC. I am a communications major so I use photoshop and other adobe programs a lot and they run great. Its super easy to use, super strong, super amazing!
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 10:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms. Music View Post
I am a college student and I have a 13 inch mac and I LOVE it. I LOVE IT! Yes, it was expensive but 2 years later it runs the same as the day I took it out of the box. It also has a longer life expectancy than a PC. I am a communications major so I use photoshop and other adobe programs a lot and they run great. Its super easy to use, super strong, super amazing!
Do you find that the screen is too small for college? Do you have an external monitor or anything?


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 10:11 PM

PC, better value for money, and windows 7 is a pretty good OS from what I've been hearing. More hardware support as well.

If you want better reliability just buy put linux on, don't spend twice as much on a mac
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 10:26 PM

There's no such thing as Mac vs. PC. Assuming PC means Personal Computer, then Macs are a type of PC. If by mac you mean Apple designed hardware, running a modern version of Mac OS 10, then yes, I would recommend a "mac"
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 4th 2010, 10:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TriBlox6432 View Post
There's no such thing as Mac vs. PC. Assuming PC means Personal Computer, then Macs are a type of PC. If by mac you mean Apple designed hardware, running a modern version of Mac OS 10, then yes, I would recommend a "mac"
I know, Mr Technical, but it was just an easy way to compare the two. Typically, PCs are associated with Windows-based operating systems and so, I chose that.


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 12:15 AM

re. 13" vs. 15," definitely take the GPU into consideration. Most 13" laptops have either integrated graphics or a discrete chip soldered onto the motherboard (non-replaceable). I have a 13" Dell XPS, and everything's up to spec except the 128 graphics card, really slows the thing down in gaming and photoshop (which I use A LOT).

As far as screen size itself, I find that larger screens are really only useful for photo/video editing and watching movies. Pretty much all laptop screens are TN panels -- I won't go into different panel types in detail but photo editing usually requires expensive PVA or IPS external monitors for color accuracy. So unless you're getting a blu-ray drive, 13" should be fine.

From personal experience, I would advise you NOT to look at Dell. My laptop has been through a fried motherboard, no sound issue requiring a format/reinstall, killed a battery in 14 months (12 month warranty period ), probably needs a replacement cooling fan, and still has annoying glitches with freezing up (which admittedly could be Windows 7). All in the past year. Of course, I have a 4-year warranty plan, which has doubled in price on the new machines (wonder why???).



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 12:17 AM

Forgot to mention:

Just personal opinion, but if I had to do the whole college thing over again, I'd go with a netbook for web surfing and taking notes in class, and a desktop for dorm use. Simply because $1000 buys an awesome desktop or a subpar laptop. Unless you're majoring in design, architecture, or engineering, in which case a $2000 laptop is probably in your future.


By the way, Windows 7 > Vista. By a fair margin.



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 01:37 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghost On The Highway View Post
Forgot to mention:

Just personal opinion, but if I had to do the whole college thing over again, I'd go with a netbook for web surfing and taking notes in class, and a desktop for dorm use. Simply because $1000 buys an awesome desktop or a subpar laptop. Unless you're majoring in design, architecture, or engineering, in which case a $2000 laptop is probably in your future.


By the way, Windows 7 > Vista. By a fair margin.
Would you buy a 13" Macbook Pro for college?


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 01:50 AM

Mac, because they are the most reliable and pretty much virus free!


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 02:45 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabrina. View Post


Would you buy a 13" Macbook Pro for college?
I wouldn't, which isn't to say that you shouldn't. The 13" MB pro, at $1499, is basically my XPS for $300 cheaper, two years later. The only differences are a 256MB graphics card vs. 128, and a 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo vs. 2.4. The games I want won't run well on a 256MB card, Photoshop alone uses ~3GB RAM for some processes, and my CPU is maxed out really often.

Of course, since you aren't a gamer, don't use CAD programs, and only rarely use Photoshop, the cheaper MB Pro ($1199) might be perfect for you. Have you used any computers running OS X? I hate it, but a lot of people love it and prefer it to Windows.

Today, If I had $1800 to spend, I'd buy an HP desktop (180t) with a Core i7, 9 GB ram, 1GB video card, etc. for $1100, spend $400 on a 23" NEC IPS panel monitor, and spend the rest on a cheap netbook for taking notes and going on vacation.



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 03:07 AM

I'm a Mac user and I only got it because I needed to run Final Cut Pro. Besides the fact that they don't really get viruses, I can't see any other reason to choose a Mac over a PC, unless, like me, you need to run specific programs that are only Mac compatible.

Macs completely suck when it comes to gaming. Like, since I have the Tiger OS, I can't run Sims3 unless I update to Leopard, which is complete garbage. Also, my battery (on my 17'' Mac Book Pro) has completely died and will not stay on for over 5 mins without being plugged in. I do have a warranty, but after a year, replacement batteries are not covered. Also, it makes this loud whirring sound... I'm going to get it checked out soon but wtf... I've only had this thing for two years and it started falling apart almost a year also. ALSO... my iPod Touch sometimes doesn't connect to the laptop. No idea why. It connects to my sister's Dell and my other home PC fine, but with my laptop, it's hit or miss.

Well, just thought I'd share my experience with my Mac Hope it was helpful... Haha
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 03:54 AM

I used a PC for years and I just bought a 13" Macbook. I LOVE it. I'd definitely suggest getting the Mac. It's durable and the battery lasts forever (like, 8 hours). I should have definitely switched to the Mac waaaaaaaaaay sooner!


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 04:43 AM

I'm not going to vote, because given what you do on the comp, it really won't matter either way.

But if you want some more flexibility (games, less software problems etc.) then I would go with PC. Macs are very practical and easy to use....But they're quite limited. Then again, you probably won't notice since you don't seem to do much stuff on it.

I personally have a high-end Desktop because I do alot of stuff on it, and I play high end games. So I know I need a good rig. I don't just use it just for internet and microsoft word. So to me, a mac would be useless.

I say do some research and find whatever is cheaper. Save that money.
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 06:00 AM

PC I can't seen to adjust to Mac my sister has one and I can't stand it.


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 5th 2010, 12:45 PM

If you've got the money and you want something decent, but for a lot, a lot more money go for a mac, but a pc won't fail you at any of those things... At the end of the day you can put windows on a mac, but you cant put os x on windows, however although I completely don't regret spending what I did on this laptop (13" macbook) you have to realise the amount you will spend on a mac is nowhere in proportion to the cost of a pc. 3 years down the line that may be another story, my macs a year old soon, the battery I've charged 523 times, (full cycles) and it still lasts me a decent time.

Be aware you will have to buy a new version/license of photoshop to use it on a mac and the same with Microsoft office, but 100% if you genuinely want a laptop to last 3 years 1 year through mine has many many more to go, but just make sure you do have that money to spend.

On the 13" or 15" side of things, I chose 13, I so much prefer smaller compact screens, I think they look much better, less chance of getting knocked I have it on a laptop tray thingy on my lap so watching films is no problem, that being said I recently got myself an external monitor for my room and the one time I do prefer it is watching films but without that I was perfectly happy too.

All in all its your choice, go have a play, the 4 finger swipe down on the trackpad, 4 finger swipe up on the trackpad, and again 4 fingers sideways are gimiky, but I use them daily, then for browsing the internet, two fingers and just drag it down to scroll, rotating photos with a twist, pinch zooming and 3 fingers back a forwards to navigate webpages, they are all so simple and yet if I try to use a laptop without them now it drives me MAD

So yeah to sum up, mine is the best computing experience I've ever had, but I paid the price and was paying it for a while, a sacrifice I was willing to make, and seeing as a PC will do the same for you just possibly slow down a little over the years, I guess you should look at that too



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 03:34 AM

I strongly recommend a "PC"

Because


Reliablity is the SAME!- Apple's and PC's uses the same suppliers! Apple uses Intel Processors like PC's! Apple uses Toshiba and Hitachi harddrives. These harddrives are sold to other computer makers! Toshiba also uses their own Harddrives for their own laptops! Apple uses FoxConn motherboard which is a popular PC motherboard manufacturer based in Taiwan... Apples main supply of graphics cards are made by Nvidia which is another company that mainly generates their revenues from PC's
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/aug2005/tc20050826_8564_tc024.htm

Leading causes of Laptop failures regardless of manufactures is the Harddrive and Motherboard. Apple uses Toshiba as a supplier for HD and a PC motherboard manufacture Foxconn for motherboards!

Latest Consumer Reports magazine issue for April/May 2010 rated Toshiba and Sony slightly more reliable than Apple But from the consumer prespective the reliablity will be identical! because the statistical differences is very very small, about 2 defects less per 100 computers. Toshiba and Sony are consistently the most reliable PC manufactures. AVOID HP, COMPAQ, ACER, Gateway and Emachines are the LEAST RELIABLE makers of PC's. DELL is in the middle

Windows 7 is very stable- I have used it for many months and Windows 7 have never crashed on me. It is considered as the best windows program ever created by many jounalist.

Todays Computers are Very Powerful-Photoshop and Sims 3 does not require high performance computer parts. In fact Photoshop CS5(professional version) and Sims 3 only requires a Pentium 4 processor not a Core Duo or i3 processor. Pentium 4 is almost 10 years old.. (it was released on nov 2000!)

More to life then a computer!- Before college you gotta buy new clothes, buy the books and school supplies! When your at school you have to pay for your rent or tuition, you would want to hang out and eat w/ your friends. You might want to travel during the vacations.

Your poor in College- If your leaving on your own or even living with your parents you are gunna be poor! Save your money so you dont need to get a side job that will distract you in your studies!

All MAC/PC Batteries go bad after a few years- Batteries in laptops are all the same(chemically speaking - they are lithium ion ). They only last for 2 years before they start to lose performance rapidly! Apple's typical battery suppliers are LG Chem(LG), Sony and Toshiba. (they make laptops too!)

2009 Macbook Pros have built in Batteries they cost 129 dollars to replace if its a 13 or 15 inch model. Or 179 dollars if its a 17 inch model. It is very expensive to replace because it requires a professional installer.
http://movies.apple.com/support/macb...rvice/battery/

Many Battery packs for PC's can easily be replaced by yourself. it will cost your around 50-70 dollars to replace a basic battery.

BOTTOM LINE!
To the average user MAC's and PC's can do the same things! Why pay more? They are all the same in the inside. The only difference is really skin deep just the program and the computer case...

JUST AVIOD HP, ACER, LENOVO, GATEWAY, COMPAQ, and EMACHINES.



PC buying tips!
buy a Sony or a Toshiba. Or even a Dell...
Sony can be abit pricey(but way less than an Apple), a Toshiba is more expensive than Hp's if you compare the specs but the reliability is among the best in the industry(just as reliable as sony but cheaper). Dell offers great deals, and their reliability is above average. For Dell computers i recommend the Studio line up or the Studio XPS.


How Much should you spend?

The base price for laptops run for about 500 dollars(avoid). But a really good laptop that is a 14 inch or a 15 inch laptop will cost around 750-850 USD. Anything more than that is over kill.

If you want performance buy any Intel Processor with 2 cores (ie Core 2 Duo, i3, i5) that is NOT a "Pentium"(which is now a low end processor). Also Aviod "Ultra Low voltage" processors from Intel if you want performance. (it is bad for gaming... even for less intensive ones) Ultra low voltage processors share the same label as the Core 2 Duo, i3 and i5 but the easiest way to tell them appart is that Intel does not have any Ultra low voltage processors that have more than 2ghz...

Buy a computer with 4 gigabytes of RAM(it is pretty common these days), any more ram is a waste of money. Aviod 2 gb or less.... at all cost!

Also Quad Cores are overkill. Many programs are designed for 1 core or 2 cores. You will benefit from 2 cores because windows 7 uses the processor really well so that you can multitask. IE virus scan while you play sims 3. Or install a program and surf the net. Burn a movie while you surf or play sims 3

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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 04:02 AM

Dell Studio 14z
674.99 before Tax

Software & Services

Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium, 64bit, English

Intel® Core™ 2 Duo P8700 (2.53GHz/1066Mhz FSB/3MB cache)

1 Year Limited Hardware Warranty (10-14 Day Mail-In Service After Remote Diagnosis)


Size: 250GB SATA Hard Drive (5400RPM)

3GB Shared Dual Channel DDR3 at 1066MHz

14.0” High Definition (720p) LED Display with TrueLife™ and Camera/Facial Recognition SW



56 Whr Lithium Ion Battery (6 cell)



Standard Keyboard

High Definition Audio 2.0

Dell 1397 Wireless-G

Black Chainlink




My Accessories Microsoft® Works 9

McAfee SecurityCenter, 30-Day Trial














Dell Online Backup 2GB for 1 year





Also Includes
Studio 14z Notebook
No Internal Mobro Selected
NVIDIA® GeForce® 9400M G
Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0

Computers have changed over the years, But they are plateauing.
this computer can serve all your needs plus some more. Imagine getting one that is worth 750-850... it is gunna be pretty powerful!
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 04:32 AM

^ Of course, being a dell, you're going to need a better service plan than that. +$150



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 12:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabrina. View Post
I will be starting university in the Fall and I'm looking to get a new laptop. Keep in mind, I will be living in residence. I've been having trouble deciding between a Mac and a PC so any opinions would be appreciated.

What I do on the computer:

- Internet (Facebook, forums, etc.)
- MS Office (reports, presentations, etc.)
- MSN/instant messengers
- Watch movies
- Listen to music
- Download
- Play minor games (i.e., Sims 3) --> very rarely
- PhotoShop --> rarely

What I am looking for in a computer:

- I'd like it to be portable since I'll be a university student and will probably have to take it places
- Relatively long battery life. The laptop I have now has like a two hour battery life so I just keep it plugged in all the time.
- Nice to look at. I hate the look of Lenovos and other ugly computers.
- Will last a long time (3 years?)

__

1) Mac or PC?

2) If Mac, based on my needs, would you get a 13" or a 15"?

Re: 13" vs 15", people are saying to get the 15" because of the new i5 processors that were put in vs. the C2Ds that are still in the 13". Thing is, the 15" is like $700 more than the 13" --> plus, the 13" is more portable and has a longer battery life.


Thoughts/opinions/suggestions?

Thanks
Go for the Mac. You'll usually find that people who insist Macs are a waste of money have never actually owned one and can't realistically comment on its reliability etc.

I've had my Mac for 1.5 years. And it has never crashed. Its battery life is still amazing, whereas my boyfriend has already had to replace the battery in his PC which is a year younger than my Mac.

A Mac can do everything that you've said there without dying, whereas I've found that PCs can have a hard time playing music and movies. A lot of games are released on both platforms now and my copy of the Sims 3 has one disc that can be used for Mac or PC. A Mac can run Windows software if necessary. It is not in any way "limited". I'll admit that I had trouble with MSN on my Mac, but I didn't really care about it, so I just took it off rather than trying to fix it, which I'm sure you could do.

And this:

Quote:
Reliablity is the SAME!- Apple's and PC's uses the same suppliers! Apple uses Intel Processors like PC's! Apple uses Toshiba and Hitachi harddrives. These harddrives are sold to other computer makers! Toshiba also uses their own Harddrives for their own laptops! Apple uses FoxConn motherboard which is a popular PC motherboard manufacturer based in Taiwan... Apples main supply of graphics cards are made by Nvidia which is another company that mainly generates their revenues from PC's
http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...8564_tc024.htm

Leading causes of Laptop failures regardless of manufactures is the Harddrive and Motherboard. Apple uses Toshiba as a supplier for HD and a PC motherboard manufacture Foxconn for motherboards!
is entirely misleading. Macs design their computers and softwares and build them to work together. With a PC, you have software and operating systems and hardware all from different companies and it means they don't run as smoothly.

Buying a cheaper computer just because it costs less will work against you in the long run. And if you actually work out the price of software etc. that you'd have to buy for a PC whereas Macs come with a lot of programs, you'll find they are about the same. The computer itself isn't the only cost.



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 03:24 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post

Go for the Mac. You'll usually find that people who insist Macs are a waste of money have never actually owned one and can't realistically comment on its reliability etc.

I've had my Mac for 1.5 years. And it has never crashed. Its battery life is still amazing, whereas my boyfriend has already had to replace the battery in his PC which is a year younger than my Mac.

A Mac can do everything that you've said there without dying, whereas I've found that PCs can have a hard time playing music and movies. A lot of games are released on both platforms now and my copy of the Sims 3 has one disc that can be used for Mac or PC. A Mac can run Windows software if necessary. It is not in any way "limited". I'll admit that I had trouble with MSN on my Mac, but I didn't really care about it, so I just took it off rather than trying to fix it, which I'm sure you could do.

And this:



is entirely misleading. Macs design their computers and softwares and build them to work together. With a PC, you have software and operating systems and hardware all from different companies and it means they don't run as smoothly.

Buying a cheaper computer just because it costs less will work against you in the long run. And if you actually work out the price of software etc. that you'd have to buy for a PC whereas Macs come with a lot of programs, you'll find they are about the same. The computer itself isn't the only cost.

Statistically, Toshiba and Sony is more reliable than Apple.. based on 2010's consumer report... Dell is really close to Apple too


Lets look at performance and Value

Dell owns Alienware and Dell branded products. Alienware is their highend brand.

Price

Apple Macbook Pro Spring 2010 Core i7M620
Current Price $2400 Released Date 04/15/2010 Still on market

Apple Macbook Pro Summer 2009
Current Price $2000 Release Date Summer 2009 Still on market

Alienware m15
Current Price $1199 Release Date 11/13/2009 Still on Market

Dell Inspiron 1564
Current Price $624 Release Date 03/01/2010 Still on Market

Apple Macbook (non-pro, white/plastic model)
Current Price $999 Release Date 10/22/2009 Still on Market
Multimedia multitasking test (in seconds)
(Shorter bars indicate better performance)

Apple MacBook Pro - Spring 2010 - Core i7 M620 15.4 inch - 2.66GHz

259



390



427



547



678






Adobe Photoshop CS3 image-processing test (in seconds)


(Shorter bars indicate better performance)






81





Apple MacBook Pro - Spring 2010 - Core i7 M620 15.4 inch - 2.66GHz



90








109








116








126









Apple iTunes encoding test (in seconds)


(Shorter bars indicate better performance)



Apple MacBook Pro - Spring 2010 - Core i7 M620 15.4 inch - 2.66GHz



128








129








135








141








164








In this test the Alienware provides the most performance for the dollar. Then the very affordable 624 dollar Dell computer.

Im not recommending these computers specifically. but This just a test based on numbers not opinions. That a 1199 dollar a 1100 top of the line Dell(alienware) computer can compete neck to neck with a Apple computer that cost 100 percent more... A cheap dell 1564 can beat an Apple macbook(non-pro version) for 30 percent less dollars!

If you buy a sony or a toshiba which is the most reliable in the Laptop industry... then expect to pay about 50 to 100 dollars more on the Dell computers. But still your computer will be FAR less expensive then apple.


Dont forget, Apple buys parts from Toshiba, and Sony.

Toshiba is also ranked the 2nd best for Customer Service on Consumer Reports' statistics. Right behind Apple... for far less money.


I own both Apple and Microsoft products.

i like them both.. but microsft is better for students. if you got alot of cash and have a secure finacial future go a head buy an apple.

I just cant recommend stuff that might be a finacial burden. I just finished College with no loans. I was fortunate for my parents to pay for 100 percent except for the books. books cost atleast 1k a year. 500 dollars per semester or 100 per class on avg. Science course cost 100+ dollars. Im an accounting major. and i took many psych,geo, sociology, and international development courses as an elective.

Last edited by Tomb; May 6th 2010 at 06:36 PM. Reason: http://reviews.cnet.com/laptops/apple-macbook-pro-spring/4505-3121_7-34058852-2.html?tag=txt;page
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 06:43 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post
Go for the Mac. You'll usually find that people who insist Macs are a waste of money have never actually owned one and can't realistically comment on its reliability etc.

I've had my Mac for 1.5 years. And it has never crashed. Its battery life is still amazing, whereas my boyfriend has already had to replace the battery in his PC which is a year younger than my Mac.

A Mac can do everything that you've said there without dying, whereas I've found that PCs can have a hard time playing music and movies. A lot of games are released on both platforms now and my copy of the Sims 3 has one disc that can be used for Mac or PC. A Mac can run Windows software if necessary. It is not in any way "limited". I'll admit that I had trouble with MSN on my Mac, but I didn't really care about it, so I just took it off rather than trying to fix it, which I'm sure you could do.
It's a common misconception that once you start using a Mac you'll fall in love with it. Recently I was forced to use a Mac (Macbook Pro) to do some iPhone programming for a tad over a week. I hated the guts out of it and handed it back as soon as I could. I know many sh*t-hot programmers who insist on only using Macs, but that's because after time they find it quicker to do tasks on a Mac, and as you know time means money. But they would never recommend a Mac to a non-professional, and while I do think they are the closest we've come to the perfect computer I still don't understand why they are so venerated.

I've had my laptop for 3 years. Battery life is pretty decent and it's only ever crashed once, due to a game that messed up with a DirectX install (a ridiculous problem that should never have happened). Since switching it over to Linux it's not even glitched. It's been knocked off tables, it's paint is worn off, and I'm wondering if the end-cheeks will last much longer; but it runs beautifully.

A PC can do everything a Mac can do without dying, PC's shouldn't die if you take care of them. A Mac cannot to the best of my knowledge run Windows software unless you dual-boot or virtualise, both of which require that you buy a copy of Windows which sort of defeats the purpose. The biggest difference? The price. Take it from someone who built a PC which outperforms his gamer friends' rigs costing twice as much - unless you seriously think you'll get use out of the streamlined Mac OS, don't waste your money.

PS:
Tomb, he's right. Since Macs run on a limited selection of hardware they have better drivers, which leads to slightly better performance and reliability.
ShimmeringFairie, when's the last time you came across a PC that had a driver problem?

Last edited by Union Of V; May 6th 2010 at 07:05 PM.
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 07:15 PM

Macs all the way. And the gaming argument is null now, as Steam is out next week. On top of that, they're faster and more reliable, almost no viruses, and the quality of the applications available is massively better.
Sure, Windows 7 is decent. It's a huuuge step up from Vista, but I'd pick Snow Leopard over it any day.
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 08:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RainOnMe View Post
Macs all the way. And the gaming argument is null now, as Steam is out next week. On top of that, they're faster and more reliable, almost no viruses, and the quality of the applications available is massively better.
Sure, Windows 7 is decent. It's a huuuge step up from Vista, but I'd pick Snow Leopard over it any day.
Actually just because it runs the Steam client doesn't mean you can play games on it. You're pretty much stuck with indie and some old mainstream games. Faster and more reliable is pretty much a myth, I debunked that in a previous thread.
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 6th 2010, 08:55 PM

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Originally Posted by Union Of V View Post
Actually just because it runs the Steam client doesn't mean you can play games on it. You're pretty much stuck with indie and some old mainstream games. Faster and more reliable is pretty much a myth, I debunked that in a previous thread.
ACtaully it does. They just wrap the games so that they work on mac. Trust me, about 5 of my friends beta test it, and I've read up. The reliability is definitely better than 90% of PC's. *cough* Dell *cough* Performance is cmpletely debatable depending on the model of the PC or Mac, so I take that back.
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 06:28 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomb View Post
Statistically, Toshiba and Sony is more reliable than Apple.. based on 2010's consumer report... Dell is really close to Apple too


Lets look at performance and Value

Dell owns Alienware and Dell branded products. Alienware is their highend brand.

Price

Apple Macbook Pro Spring 2010 Core i7M620
Current Price $2400 Released Date 04/15/2010 Still on market

Apple Macbook Pro Summer 2009
Current Price $2000 Release Date Summer 2009 Still on market

Alienware m15
Current Price $1199 Release Date 11/13/2009 Still on Market

Dell Inspiron 1564
Current Price $624 Release Date 03/01/2010 Still on Market

Apple Macbook (non-pro, white/plastic model)
Current Price $999 Release Date 10/22/2009 Still on Market
Multimedia multitasking test (in seconds)
(Shorter bars indicate better performance)

Apple MacBook Pro - Spring 2010 - Core i7 M620 15.4 inch - 2.66GHz

259



390



427



547



678






Adobe Photoshop CS3 image-processing test (in seconds)


(Shorter bars indicate better performance)






81





Apple MacBook Pro - Spring 2010 - Core i7 M620 15.4 inch - 2.66GHz



90








109








116








126









Apple iTunes encoding test (in seconds)


(Shorter bars indicate better performance)



Apple MacBook Pro - Spring 2010 - Core i7 M620 15.4 inch - 2.66GHz



128








129








135








141








164








In this test the Alienware provides the most performance for the dollar. Then the very affordable 624 dollar Dell computer.

Im not recommending these computers specifically. but This just a test based on numbers not opinions. That a 1199 dollar a 1100 top of the line Dell(alienware) computer can compete neck to neck with a Apple computer that cost 100 percent more... A cheap dell 1564 can beat an Apple macbook(non-pro version) for 30 percent less dollars!

If you buy a sony or a toshiba which is the most reliable in the Laptop industry... then expect to pay about 50 to 100 dollars more on the Dell computers. But still your computer will be FAR less expensive then apple.


Dont forget, Apple buys parts from Toshiba, and Sony.

Toshiba is also ranked the 2nd best for Customer Service on Consumer Reports' statistics. Right behind Apple... for far less money.


I own both Apple and Microsoft products.

i like them both.. but microsft is better for students. if you got alot of cash and have a secure finacial future go a head buy an apple.

I just cant recommend stuff that might be a finacial burden. I just finished College with no loans. I was fortunate for my parents to pay for 100 percent except for the books. books cost atleast 1k a year. 500 dollars per semester or 100 per class on avg. Science course cost 100+ dollars. Im an accounting major. and i took many psych,geo, sociology, and international development courses as an elective.
What statistics? If you're going to argue things like that, you need sources and evidence to back it up. Who says that statistically Sony and Toshiba are better? Where are you getting your information about what parts Apple uses? Also, your links aren't actually links, so I have no idea why they are there. And I have never, ever, ever heard any good things about Dells, so I really doubt they are just behind Macs in terms of reliability.

Quote:

It's a common misconception that once you start using a Mac you'll fall in love with it. Recently I was forced to use a Mac (Macbook Pro) to do some iPhone programming for a tad over a week. I hated the guts out of it and handed it back as soon as I could. I know many sh*t-hot programmers who insist on only using Macs, but that's because after time they find it quicker to do tasks on a Mac, and as you know time means money. But they would never recommend a Mac to a non-professional, and while I do think they are the closest we've come to the perfect computer I still don't understand why they are so venerated.

I've had my laptop for 3 years. Battery life is pretty decent and it's only ever crashed once, due to a game that messed up with a DirectX install (a ridiculous problem that should never have happened). Since switching it over to Linux it's not even glitched. It's been knocked off tables, it's paint is worn off, and I'm wondering if the end-cheeks will last much longer; but it runs beautifully.

A PC can do everything a Mac can do without dying, PC's shouldn't die if you take care of them. A Mac cannot to the best of my knowledge run Windows software unless you dual-boot or virtualise, both of which require that you buy a copy of Windows which sort of defeats the purpose. The biggest difference? The price. Take it from someone who built a PC which outperforms his gamer friends' rigs costing twice as much - unless you seriously think you'll get use out of the streamlined Mac OS, don't waste your money.
But why did you hate the Mac? They can take some getting used to, but that's only because everyone has usually used a PC first. It doesn't really make sense that you wouldn't recommend a Mac to a non-professional, they aren't any harder to use than any other computer. And if you are willing to say that a Mac is the closest to a perfect computer, why are you so against them?

They cost more than some other computers. But there are some computers that cost more than them, so it's not a great argument. And it's not like Windows doesn't charge ridiculous prices for their software. With a Mac, you're paying for what you get. They come with programs that you would have to pay for on a Windows system.

I wouldn't say that a PC can do everything that a Mac can. They can't run Apple software, as far as I know. And a Mac can with Parallels, plus they make Microsoft software for Macs (Word, Excel etc.). And like I said my Mac has never crashed, and neither has my dad's which is way older. But I've seen PCs freeze, crash, die, get viruses and so on. My boyfriend's PC has crashed a couple of times and he has already had problems with the battery.



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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 06:43 AM

Apple makes all the parts themselves other than the Intel processor as far as I know. It says on their site somewhere, can't remember where...
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 07:09 AM

I disliked macs ever since I went to jr. high and I don't think that's going to change in this life.

I'd go with windows because there is SO much more you can do with it and I personally think the layout is much nicer.


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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 04:44 PM

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Originally Posted by Gixxers rock View Post
I disliked macs ever since I went to jr. high and I don't think that's going to change in this life.

I'd go with windows because there is SO much more you can do with it and I personally think the layout is much nicer.
What do you mean by 'you can do so much more with it'? As far as I'm aware, the opportunities are the same. And the layout is, as you said, personal preference.
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 08:13 PM

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ACtaully it does. They just wrap the games so that they work on mac. Trust me, about 5 of my friends beta test it, and I've read up. The reliability is definitely better than 90% of PC's. *cough* Dell *cough* Performance is cmpletely debatable depending on the model of the PC or Mac, so I take that back.
I've never had ANY problems with the Steam client (even running the Windows version on Linux!!). And the games don't simply work (I could post a news report but this is more persuasive). Believe me the only way to run Windows-only games on other OS's is with Wine, and that's Linux-only.
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 08:38 PM

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Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post
But why did you hate the Mac? They can take some getting used to, but that's only because everyone has usually used a PC first. It doesn't really make sense that you wouldn't recommend a Mac to a non-professional, they aren't any harder to use than any other computer. And if you are willing to say that a Mac is the closest to a perfect computer, why are you so against them?
I couldn't exactly pinpoint why I hate the Mac. I'd say it's because I find the interface unintuitive (having to wait for the icons at the bottom of the screen to pop up is a pain. switching programs is a pain. dealing with multiple windows of the same program is a pain.). Why is it "better" in my opinion? It's more streamlined, more consistent. But I feel that in trying to streamline the interface (which they've done very well) the Apple designers have shied too much away from mouse actions and relied on keyboard shortcuts instead. While that leads to more efficient computing, it makes using it a slog as you waste time simply trying to get the curser in the right place (not easy on a trackpad). Look at any pro using a Mac and they're flying, but if you don't use it very often it's an undesirable tradeoff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post
They cost more than some other computers. But there are some computers that cost more than them, so it's not a great argument. And it's not like Windows doesn't charge ridiculous prices for their software. With a Mac, you're paying for what you get. They come with programs that you would have to pay for on a Windows system.
They cost much more than a comparable Windows rig. €100 for an OS is not ridiculous. And if you want free programs look into open source (GIMP = photoshop with a few less filters for FREE).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post
I wouldn't say that a PC can do everything that a Mac can. They can't run Apple software, as far as I know. And a Mac can with Parallels, plus they make Microsoft software for Macs (Word, Excel etc.). And like I said my Mac has never crashed, and neither has my dad's which is way older. But I've seen PCs freeze, crash, die, get viruses and so on. My boyfriend's PC has crashed a couple of times and he has already had problems with the battery.
They can't run Apple software. Seriously? It's not like Apple has the monopoly on anything (bar tools for developing on Apple devices obviously). Lets see... The backup program is one of the best out there, but not many people use computers enough to realize (or even use) it. Logic? Sure it's cheaper than Pro Tools or Cubase, but you more than make up with it by spending more on the PC in the first place. What else is there?

And yes, I've seen PC's have problems, but it's almost always due to viruses and hardware faults. The hardware faults can be avoided by not buying from Dell or, if you're paranoid, building yourself. Viruses? If you're not running an antivirus on a PC you primarily use for browsing the internet, then you shouldn't be allowed access to it full stop.
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 08:53 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimmeringFaerie View Post

What statistics? If you're going to argue things like that, you need sources and evidence to back it up. Who says that statistically Sony and Toshiba are better? Where are you getting your information about what parts Apple uses? Also, your links aren't actually links, so I have no idea why they are there. And I have never, ever, ever heard any good things about Dells, so I really doubt they are just behind Macs in terms of reliability.

Your exprience is very limited compared to thousands of users... In fact this statistic i will be showing is based on 75 thousand people. NOT my sister, cousin, grandma or my friend.

The statistic is based on 4 years

Toshiba = 16 repairs out of 100 units..
Sony = 17 repairs out of 100
HP = 20 repairs out of 100
Apple = 19 repairs out of 100
Acer = 19 repairs out of 100
Lenovo = 21 repairs out of 100

Source: Consumer Reports, June 2010 Issue page 32. Go to your local news stand or library to see it.


Consumer Report is a highly regarded magazine. Consumer report is published by "Consumers Union" the worlds largest indepenedent consumer product testing organization. The organization surveys millions of consumer experiences wih products and services. The organization is a non profit organization.

How do they test products?
They dont accept advertising, instead they get their money mainly through subscriptions and donations. They dont accept free samples from manufacturers. THEY BUY THE PRODUCTS THEY TEST.

They buy and test over 100 cars. From Luxury cars to econoboxes.

So this is not some small organization. theyve been around since 1936. with 7.3 million suscribers...

Many news companies consider Consumer Reports as experts. Like CNN and New York Times
http://money.cnn.com/2010/05/07/auto...n=money_latest

When Consumer Reports listed Toyota's Lexus as a recommended "Dont buy".. Toyota stopped producing the 65 thousand dollar SUV.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/14/business/14auto.html

" Toyota quickly suspended sales of its 2010 Lexus GX 460 sport utility vehicle on Tuesday after Consumer Reports magazine warned buyers that the model had a dangerous handling problem that could lead to a rollover and possibly “serious injury or death.” "

----------------------------------------------------------
Look at Apples bad score above its based on the last 4 years...

Face it if your bad at keeping a PC in good condition then the Apple will not last as long as your old toshiba or sony...

If your Apple last for many years. then your Toshiba or sony may out last th apple...



Also Apple obvously doent make all their parts. In fact their computers are made in China...

Apple computer parts are not made by themselves. Heck Toyota, Honda, Ford, and GM doesnt make all their parts. Its about the SUPPLIER SUPPLIER SUPPLIERS!

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUST20267020090722

"In January, Apple entered into a five-year agreement with South Korea's LG Display (034220.KS) for LCD panels in a deal that included an upfront payment by Apple of $500 million."

"Apple Inc (AAPL.O) has entered into a long-term supply agreement with Toshiba Corp (6502.T) for NAND-type flash chips in a sign that the chip market could be on the road to recovery."
For their Iphone, ipods and higher end laptops. that uses no harddrive, but with a solid state instead.



"Apple is investigating whether or not faulty Seagate hard drives are to blame for data loss on some MacBooks.
Retrodata, a U.K. data recovery firm, reported earlier this year that certain 2.5-inch Seagate drives used in MacBooks had a manufacturing flaw that causes the drive heads to scratch the surface of the drive and cause major problems. InformationWeek contacted Apple about the problem, and a company representative said, "We've received a few reports that some MacBook consumer notebooks may have hard-drive issues, and we're looking into it." An e-mail to the same representative checking on whether or not that meant Apple was looking into the specific issue identified by Retrodata, or just MacBook hard-drive issues in general, was not immediately returned."

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-9823370-37.html

Atleast these harddrives are not the ones made by Toshiba...


"Apple Computer is recalling 1.8 million batteries that use Sony's battery cell technology"
http://news.cnet.com/Apple-recalls-1...3-6109198.html



"In July 2008, NVIDIA publicly acknowledged a higher than normal failure rate for some of their graphics processors due to a packaging defect. At that same time, NVIDIA assured Apple that Mac computers with these graphics processors were not affected. However, after an Apple-led investigation, Apple has determined that some MacBook Pro computers with the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics processor may be affected. If the NVIDIA graphics processor in your MacBook Pro has failed, or fails within three years of the original date of purchase, a repair will be done free of charge, even if your MacBook Pro is out of warranty."
http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2377



Now you have your facts. about Apples quality and Apple suppliers.

Apples harddrives are made by toshiba and seagate. LG makes Apples LCD screens for macbooks. Toshiba builds the memory systems for iphones, ipods and high end macs. Sony supples apple with batteries. And the biggest supplier of video cards for PC's Nvidia supplies video cards to Apple for their macbooks.

Hmmm what other parts are their in a macbook. Intel builds the processors?

Do they test it i dont know? But do they build them...? No, child labour builds apple products in inhumane sweat shop conditions.

"Technology giant Apple has admitted that child labour has been employed at some of the factories that build its iPods, computers and mobile phones."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...factories.html



When you buy an apple product. how much profit do they make for 2010???

ALOT

Lets look at cellphones
Apple 57 percent gross margin
HTC 31 gross margin
Motorola 32 percent gross margin
http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2010/03/...fit-an-iphone/



I estimate Apples gross margins for laptops and desktop to be around 30 percent

Gross margin = Revenue- Cost of Goods sold.

Why dont they give some of the profit to the kids that apple have exploited?

Last edited by Tomb; May 7th 2010 at 09:00 PM.
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 7th 2010, 09:25 PM

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Originally Posted by Union Of V View Post
I've never had ANY problems with the Steam client (even running the Windows version on Linux!!). And the games don't simply work (I could post a news report but this is more persuasive). Believe me the only way to run Windows-only games on other OS's is with Wine, and that's Linux-only.
You were right, and I take it back. I'm not sure how they've got so many games working though. I'll ask them..
   
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 8th 2010, 09:31 AM

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You were right, and I take it back. I'm not sure how they've got so many games working though. I'll ask them..
In order to make the Mac Steam client more attractive Valve ported a lot of their games (TF2, CSS and the Half Life's). I'm guessing that's what they're playing
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Re: Mac vs PC - May 8th 2010, 12:11 PM

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Originally Posted by Union Of V View Post
In order to make the Mac Steam client more attractive Valve ported a lot of their games (TF2, CSS and the Half Life's). I'm guessing that's what they're playing
Maybe you're right. Hmm, I'll still have an ask around
Oh they ported Poral and Portal 2 will be Mac and PC too.
   
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