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Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 07:58 AM

So ... Lady Gaga (I know) is trying to enforce a law to make bulling illegal.
Her reasons are that many a time, bullies are no more than killers. Bulling is a hate crime and must be made illegal.

This was bought on by one of her fans commiting suicide over taunts about his sexuality.

I don't know, I agree, bulling is wrong and does lead to many suicides... however, most people bullied find it hard to speak up. So could a law like this work?

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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 12:58 PM

I posted a rant about this on FB the other night, let me find it...

"Lady Gaga related post alert - On Twitter, she posted this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=-Pb1CaGMdWk It's of a 14 year old kid talking months ago about how life gets better, and bullying passes etc, yet he recently killed himself. It's tragic, it is, and I doubt any one of you would suggest otherwise. But now she's all up in a fit of rage to make bullying illegal. She's stated her intent to meet the President. She wants "MakeALawForJamey" trending on Twitter to spread awareness. There's something about this that irks me. I can't help feeling she's using it as a publicity stunt, or she's punching above her weight, or something I can't quite put my finger on. I just feel she should stick to writing pop songs and stop trying to meddle in the affairs of the world that people are very aware of already."

Yeah, I agree bullying needs dealt with. I don't think Lady Gaga should be anywhere near anything to do with it.




   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 01:17 PM

I did watch the YouTube vid, yes, he's saying a serious message, but it's terribly hypocritical It gets better, I promise... it's sad, but i agree, shes a pop star, not a martyr




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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 02:06 PM

I wouldn't say bullies are "Killers" because no one kills themself over bullying if they didn't have problems beforehand.

That being said, I was bullied very badly for a good three years, and that I why I am homeschooled and get anxious around people my age. I was teased, hit, punched, you name it. It was very hard to go through at the time, and I would actually fake having stomach flu (By forcing myself to throw up) to avoid having to go to school. Being bullied ****ing sucks. It really does.

That being said, if my parents realized the severity of the bulling sooner, it would have stopped. If my teachers had stepped in after I, and my family filed multiple complaints it would have stopped sooner. If the prinicpal had taken action when I personally visited him, it would have stopped.

It wasn't a hate crime to me, it was because I was short and weak. I was an easy target, it wasn't based on sexuality, race or even age. They weren't "Killers" I survived. (Albeit, on my last day of school before I willing left, I roundhoused my tormentor in the jaw, and actually got conmended by all the other students and faculity.)

But I don't know why I'm ranting on, what I'm getting at is yes, bullying should be dealt with more seriously, but who draws the line between bullying and friendly teasing? I mean my friends and I all have obscene nicknames for each other, does this count? What if the bullying was verbal, and you have no proof? I mean it's kind of silly.

Glen Coco a martyr is someone who dies for what they believe in, like how Jesus was hung on the cross. What "Lady Gaga" is trying to acomplish is more like playing messiah.

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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 03:20 PM

Bullying suck, but good god bullies aren't killers. I think we should focus more on all of these kids thinking suicide is an option. I mean bullying is a part of childhood more pretty much everyone whether they are the bully or the victim. Kids are stupid and mean, and they are going to continue to be stupid and mean, are we gonna arrest a 5 year old that picks on someone? We should focus on teaching kids why suicide should never be an option that I believe would be much more effective.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 04:23 PM

I really can't see this happening. Passing as a federal law enforceable by all Federal Agents/Officers would have to: A.) Fit into the Commerce clause, B.) An action against the United states, C.) An action against our national security, D.) to enforce the US constitution E). An action taking place on federal land, etc... So an anti bullying federal law, I just cant see it being done legally. This seems more like a state issue rather then one of the Federal Government.
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 05:50 PM

Agreed. Alltho, people may not have had previous problems. I don't understand?
Also, Yes, ofc bullying differs from friendly taunts. You can tell the difference between a friend calling you names as teasing and someone calling you names hurtfully.
Actually. I think it depends, if you are friends
"Whatever Jem you loser"
But someone who isn't
"Whatever Jem, you loser"
Is going to sound a lot worse... Hm.




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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 07:31 PM

We are taking this shit what to god damn seriously. Criminals? Come the fuck on.

Is bullying a serious issue? Yes. Are we approaching it in the right manner? Not even fucking close.

As someone who was bullied as a kid, I can tell you that this is all going in the wrong fucking direction.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 23rd 2011, 07:47 PM

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Originally Posted by TigerTank77 View Post
We are taking this shit what to god damn seriously. Criminals? Come the fuck on.

Is bullying a serious issue? Yes. Are we approaching it in the right manner? Not even fucking close.

As someone who was bullied as a kid, I can tell you that this is all going in the wrong fucking direction.
How do you suggest they hadle it then, what should be done instead?

There's no question that bullying is wrong and there should be consequences for it. There's also no question that it should NEVER be bad enough that someone is contemplating suicide as an option to get away from it. Having said that, however, there is absolutely NO WAY to enforce this. That's aside from the fact that who decides what constitutes bullying vs. innappropriate comments here or there and would this change how hate crimes are handled or what's considered a legit hate crime, because those actually do happen?


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 12:09 AM

This kind of strikes me as incredibly impractical. So if you make a snide comment about another girl (for instance) then you should be charged? Everyone has bullied someone in one form or another in their lives. And believe it or not, not everyone who gets bullied is gay. Bullying doesn't always happen because someone's gay. There's a whole lot more that goes into it than that. Bullies are people too. They're kids. And kids are going to make fun of other kids. We can't charge every single thirteen year old boy who called another boy a faggot. I'm not saying bullying's right, I'm saying that the way we're treating it is way off the mark.
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 01:51 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snufkin View Post
I posted a rant about this on FB the other night, let me find it...

"Lady Gaga related post alert - On Twitter, she posted this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=-Pb1CaGMdWk It's of a 14 year old kid talking months ago about how life gets better, and bullying passes etc, yet he recently killed himself. It's tragic, it is, and I doubt any one of you would suggest otherwise. But now she's all up in a fit of rage to make bullying illegal. She's stated her intent to meet the President. She wants "MakeALawForJamey" trending on Twitter to spread awareness. There's something about this that irks me. I can't help feeling she's using it as a publicity stunt, or she's punching above her weight, or something I can't quite put my finger on. I just feel she should stick to writing pop songs and stop trying to meddle in the affairs of the world that people are very aware of already."

Yeah, I agree bullying needs dealt with. I don't think Lady Gaga should be anywhere near anything to do with it.
I couldn't disagree harder. The average person is, in the grand scheme of things, meaningless. However good our actions and intentions are, they aren't going to change the world. Very few people are in position to actually have millions of people listen when they speak, and so I will applaud any such person who speaks well about things that matter. Fame is a potent tool, and anyone who attempts to use their power for good is worth supporting.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 02:09 AM

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This kind of strikes me as incredibly impractical.
You do realize we're talking about Lady Gaga? The lady is impractical and extreme.

Again though, I do not believe the criminally charging people for bullying is a good idea, but I do agree that school need to learn to deal with bullying, or else the school board will be criminally charged. So instead of punished the bully, punish those who refused to listen to the victim, and therefore stop the bullying. I honestly think bullying is caused by negligence of the staff. They see bullying happening, they are told about bullying, and yet they do jack all about it.

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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 02:09 AM

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I couldn't disagree harder. The average person is, in the grand scheme of things, meaningless. However good our actions and intentions are, they aren't going to change the world. Very few people are in position to actually have millions of people listen when they speak, and so I will applaud any such person who speaks well about things that matter. Fame is a potent tool, and anyone who attempts to use their power for good is worth supporting.

I don't disagree with that. Hugh Grant is using his fame atm to battle against News International and the phone hacking scandal. The difference is I don't believe he's doing it to win people over.

Though, maybe I'm just being a bit cynical.




   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 02:31 AM

I disagree with this a lot. Especially because in my experience there's usually a psychological reason people bully others.



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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 03:07 AM

Here's the thing I still know the people that used to bully me. And guess what they've done what all bullies do, they've grown up. They aren't bad people, certainly not people that should have a criminal record for some stupid comments they made when they were KIDS!


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 04:29 AM

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I disagree with this a lot. Especially because in my experience there's usually a psychological reason people bully others.
You're point? I don't agree with criminally charging bullies, but there is a psychological reasons to as why someone would murder their entire family, I don't suspect you would want them to "get off" without first recieving some form of punishment.

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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 08:16 AM

This is pure and utter nonsense. When it comes to suicide, I blame one person the most: the person who killed themselves because no matter what their situation, they were the one who did the deed. Bullying isn't the best thing on Earth, it's sometimes bad but you have politicians, groups and others in power going bonkers over this, treating it as though bullies are stone-cold murderers.

Also, you need a solid legal definition of bullying. What happens when, say, Tom (the leader), Dave and Matt bully Kyle for 5 years always on school grounds until he commits suicide BUT only Tom is charged? Or better yet, what if all 3 boys are charged yet it's made obvious that the teachers and principal witnessed the bullying each school day but did nothing to help or intervene? Surely they share much of the blame as well but by charging only Tom or all 3 boys, it's incorrectly implied it was only their faults for Kyle's suicide.

To make matters more confusing, what about cyber-bullying? Suppose the entire school of 1,500 students all contribute to multiple web pages of degrading and humiliating Kyle, who once again cant stand it so he offs himself? Do you have 1,500+ counts of bullying/other crimes or do you pick only a few bullies to be held accountable?

This craze of "oh no, bullying is bad bad bad bad" is ridiculous as it entails moronic solutions that are impractical and based mostly on emotion. I'll be the devil's advocate by saying some bullying is good because it gets kids to (ideally) toughen up and not be a weak flake who runs and complains when someone is mean to him/her. A bit of hurt is necessary to some degree. You've also got to consider the child bully themselves as they're always ignored in these moronic chants to have bullies punished. The only time I support a bully being legally punished is if he/she causes serious bodily harm to someone or a similar crime, or crimes such as defamation causing harm. Calling someone a name or insulting them is hardly a crime, everyone would be guilty, even those who are the biggest proponents of punishing bullies.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 10:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snufkin View Post
Lady Gaga related post alert - On Twitter, she posted this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-Pb1CaGMdWk It's of a 14 year old kid talking months ago about how life gets better, and bullying passes etc, yet he recently killed himself. It's tragic, it is, and I doubt any one of you would suggest otherwise. But now she's all up in a fit of rage to make bullying illegal. She's stated her intent to meet the President. She wants "MakeALawForJamey" trending on Twitter to spread awareness. There's something about this that irks me. I can't help feeling she's using it as a publicity stunt, or she's punching above her weight, or something I can't quite put my finger on. I just feel she should stick to writing pop songs and stop trying to meddle in the affairs of the world that people are very aware of already."

I totally agree with you here. I think that celebrities sometimes do
amazing things to benefit charities. However, it's issues like this that make me roll my eyes.

I mean, putting your face to a cause and encouraging people to donate money or go green or write to your local official is great. But what does she think she's going to achieve here? In ten years, are we going to teach kids about what that thing 'bullying' was?

"Well kids, people used to be mean to others for no reason at all, but our gracious president Lady Gaga put an end to that."

I just have to think, as someone who just plays music and does 'crazy' things for a living, how important must you have to think you actually are to basically demand something so huge and think that people will listen merely because you're you? Does she really think she's important enough to meet with the president to discuss 'stopping bullying', and that out of the millions and millions of people who try to do this everyday, she will be the one to actually stop it, because, you know, she wears meat dresses and stuff?

If she was really so touched about this, I don't understand why she can't start a 'bullying awareness' campaign or 'victims of bullying' charity. Why can't she hold a concert and have the money go towards suicide prevention? why can't she speak to teenagers about how she didn't make it to where she is by knocking people down? Why can't she write a song for the boy and donate all the profits to a programme dedicated to warning kids about the dangers of bullying?

I just think it's arrogant and self righteous. There were a lot of things she could have done but she's using this kids tragic story for her own benefit.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 12:22 PM

Not to sound stupid or anything but can't you, for the majority of bullying, take legal actions to stop bullying? Like reporting them for assault or harassment?
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 04:13 PM

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Not to sound stupid or anything but can't you, for the majority of bullying, take legal actions to stop bullying? Like reporting them for assault or harassment?
It depends on exactly what happened and how and sometimes people are afraid that reporting them will make it worse because the person will come after them more. A lot of times if there's no physical injury or obvious verbal threat nothing can be done even if the victim says something. You also have to deal with the bully's parents who want to believe that their kid would never do whatever they're being accused of and if the bully denies it the issue is often dropped.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 04:26 PM

I thought if bullying continued long enough it is illegal as you could say they are harrassing you or you could report them for assault, and then there is cyber bullying which has always been illegal. Bullying happens and always will happen. I've been bullied a-lot over the years and while its not part of life and it is not very nice to be bullied, it does happens. I think if you tell teachers and nothing gets done then yes go to the police and file a harassment/assault complaint.

Bullying is already somewhat illegal, It's nice that lady gaga wants to raise awareness, its just a shame it took one of her fans to commit suicide for her to want raise awareness. She should want to make it illegal and raise awareness without the fact that one of her fans committed suicide over bullying. It's an important cause, awareness should be raised suicide or no suicide, its a shame that most celebs chose to raise awareness because a fan of their music has killed themselves due to bullying.



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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 04:42 PM

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I thought if bullying continued long enough it is illegal as you could say they are harrassing you or you could report them for assault, and then there is cyber bullying which has always been illegal. Bullying happens and always will happen. I've been bullied a-lot over the years and while its not part of life and it is not very nice to be bullied, it does happens. I think if you tell teachers and nothing gets done then yes go to the police and file a harassment/assault complaint.

Bullying is already somewhat illegal, It's nice that lady gaga wants to raise awareness, its just a shame it took one of her fans to commit suicide for her to want raise awareness. She should want to make it illegal and raise awareness without the fact that one of her fans committed suicide over bullying. It's an important cause, awareness should be raised suicide or no suicide, its a shame that most celebs chose to raise awareness because a fan of their music has killed themselves due to bullying.

It's unfortunate, but it isn't just celebrities who are like that, a lot of times someone has to be affected by something (fill in any cause you like here) and then they become involved in awareness, prevention, treatment etc.

Bullying isn't really illegal unless it crosses an obvious line and cyberbullying is even harder to legislate because there is no specific legal category for it to fit into. As I said before, I'm all for kids having consequences for saying or doing something wrong or innappropriate,but the punishment has to fit the action and too often either nothing is done, or the punishment is too harsh. I also have an issue with these zero tolerance policies where the victim gets punished too, but that's beside the point.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 06:32 PM

What about growing a backbone? Yes, people arnt always nice but being knocked down and getting back up is part of growing up.
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 24th 2011, 08:32 PM

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What about growing a backbone? Yes, people arnt always nice but being knocked down and getting back up is part of growing up.
Couldn't have said it any better.


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September 25th 2011, 06:44 AM

Not to sound mean to the kid. But he commited suicide. He went to hell, I doubt that's any better.
God, if she does get the privilige of meeting your president I hope she years something suitable. Shock factor wont impress.

I mean WEARS something suitable. Predictive texting on my phone x




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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 25th 2011, 07:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glen Coco View Post
Not to sound mean to the kid. But he commited suicide. He went to hell, I doubt that's any better.
I love it when people try to say stuff like this like it's fact.

Let's say it is fact, then he probably did the right thing anyway. I mean, he was gay, so he was going to sizzle eventually, might as well be sooner rather than later. The bullies should be commended for carrying out Gods work.


To love. To be loved. To never forget your own insignificance. To never get used to the unspeakable violence and the vulgar disparity of life around you. To seek joy in the saddest places. To pursue beauty to its lair. To never simplify what is complicated or complicate what is simple. To respect strength, never power. Above all, to watch. To try and understand. To never look away. And never, never, to forget

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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 25th 2011, 07:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glen Coco View Post
Not to sound mean to the kid. But he commited suicide. He went to hell, I doubt that's any better.
God, if she does get the privilige of meeting your president I hope she years something suitable. Shock factor wont impress.
It boggles my mind that people still believe things like that.


The atoms that make up you and me were born in the hearts of suns many times greater than ours, and in time our atoms will once again reside amongst the stars. Life is but an idle dalliance of the cosmos, frail, and soon forgotten. We have been set adrift in an ocean whose tides we are only beginning to comprehend and with that maturity has come the realization that we are, at least for now, alone. In that loneliness, it falls to us to shine as brightly as the stars from which we came.
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 25th 2011, 04:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glen Coco View Post
Not to sound mean to the kid. But he commited suicide. He went to hell, I doubt that's any better.
Attitudes like this should have died out decades ago. There's no place for you in modern society.
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 25th 2011, 05:06 PM

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Originally Posted by Glen Coco View Post
Not to sound mean to the kid. But he commited suicide. He went to hell, I doubt that's any better.
Because this is such a loving attitude and sure to get you to heaven.
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 25th 2011, 05:52 PM

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Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
This is pure and utter nonsense. When it comes to suicide, I blame one person the most: the person who killed themselves because no matter what their situation, they were the one who did the deed. Bullying isn't the best thing on Earth, it's sometimes bad but you have politicians, groups and others in power going bonkers over this, treating it as though bullies are stone-cold murderers.
So, just for clarity's sake, the fact that the suicidal thought process is a manifestation of a severe psychological disfunction has nothing to do with it then? And the actions of those bullying the person clearly had no role to play at all in the development of this thought process?

Sarcasm aside, trivialising the causes of suicide is pretty ill-advised particularly given the physiological aspects involved of which I'm sure you're aware. You're talking about overriding the most basic survival mechanisms we have, after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
Also, you need a solid legal definition of bullying. What happens when, say, Tom (the leader), Dave and Matt bully Kyle for 5 years always on school grounds until he commits suicide BUT only Tom is charged? Or better yet, what if all 3 boys are charged yet it's made obvious that the teachers and principal witnessed the bullying each school day but did nothing to help or intervene? Surely they share much of the blame as well but by charging only Tom or all 3 boys, it's incorrectly implied it was only their faults for Kyle's suicide.
That's less a question of defining bullying in a legal context and more a question of devising the appropriate legal remedy. All of the above could be indicted to varying degrees of severity and dealt with accordingly - particularly given that in the case of the teachers and the principal they have a legal duty of care which has been breached. Achieving a workable definition and framework is not the Herculean task you make it out to be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
To make matters more confusing, what about cyber-bullying? Suppose the entire school of 1,500 students all contribute to multiple web pages of degrading and humiliating Kyle, who once again cant stand it so he offs himself? Do you have 1,500+ counts of bullying/other crimes or do you pick only a few bullies to be held accountable?
Depending on the severity of their statements, yes, you could hold them all accountable. Decategorising something as a harmful activity or one the law should punish simply because of the floodgates argument is no argument at all really - to give some perspective, there have been more people than that arrested for the riots over here in August. Also, why apply that rationale to these actions and not others such as petty theft or vehicle crime? I trust you can see the contradiction there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
This craze of "oh no, bullying is bad bad bad bad" is ridiculous as it entails moronic solutions that are impractical and based mostly on emotion. I'll be the devil's advocate by saying some bullying is good because it gets kids to (ideally) toughen up and not be a weak flake who runs and complains when someone is mean to him/her. A bit of hurt is necessary to some degree. You've also got to consider the child bully themselves as they're always ignored in these moronic chants to have bullies punished. The only time I support a bully being legally punished is if he/she causes serious bodily harm to someone or a similar crime, or crimes such as defamation causing harm. Calling someone a name or insulting them is hardly a crime, everyone would be guilty, even those who are the biggest proponents of punishing bullies.
As someone who was bullied for a significant period of time at school, you will perhaps forgive me if I disagree completely with the notion that bullying encourages people to "toughen up and not be a weak flake". In my experience, it merely destroyed my self-esteem completely which took a fair few years to rebuild, and I am hardly a "weak flake". I got into fights with these people for goodness' sake, and "won" a fair few times, but I was still the one who had to deal with the longer-term damage it left so I feel I am qualified to speak out on this point. Bullying is not character building, unless you class "character building" as regular humiliation in front of your peer group with no one giving a damn to intervene and in some cases taking part themselves. I realise I am fairly biased on this topic, but for me statements like yours completely miss the point.


"The greatest glory in living lies not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall." - Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

However bleak things seem, however insurmountable the darkness appears, remember that you have worth and nothing can take that away.

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Originally Posted by OMFG!You'reActuallySmart! View Post
If you're referring to dr2005's response, it's not complex, however, he has a way with words .
RIP Nick

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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 25th 2011, 09:33 PM

Gay bullying is a hate crime, as it specifically targets a member or members of a specific group of people. Regular bullying can be prosecuted under the circumstances, assault, harassment, etc. In some cases, when the victim commits suicide, the bully(ies) can be charged with negligent homicide or manslaughter if it can be proven to where the victim committed suicide because of their actions.

Not everyone can "grow a pair" or a backbone, sometimes bullies take away the power from the victim to get help, forcing them into a place where they feel is no hope. I've helped and counciled many kids, all of which felt no one would would care about them. Bullying shouldn't be a part of growing up, nor should it be accepted.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 03:17 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr2005 View Post
You're talking about overriding the most basic survival mechanisms we have, after all.
I never mentioned nor implied over-riding anything in that part of my post, so can you explain to me how you think I did?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr2005 View Post
As someone who was bullied for a significant period of time at school, you will perhaps forgive me if I disagree completely with the notion that bullying encourages people to "toughen up and not be a weak flake". In my experience, it merely destroyed my self-esteem completely which took a fair few years to rebuild, and I am hardly a "weak flake". I got into fights with these people for goodness' sake, and "won" a fair few times, but I was still the one who had to deal with the longer-term damage it left so I feel I am qualified to speak out on this point. Bullying is not character building, unless you class "character building" as regular humiliation in front of your peer group with no one giving a damn to intervene and in some cases taking part themselves. I realise I am fairly biased on this topic, but for me statements like yours completely miss the point.
You bring up a fair point, however, I addressed that in that part of the post you quoted by saying toughening up is the ideal outcome. For that reason, I do view bullying as "character building", although I admit, the process has many holes and isn't pleasant. I would say that ideally (with a capital I), bullying does make people toughen up AND others do jump in to stop before it gets too severe, so there's a bit of hurt but nothing too severe and damaging. I realize this ideal is far out of this world and rarely, if ever, happens in the present time.

On a separate note, I'd say your bullying experience is like the majority's. Mine was only briefly like that as it then made a sharp turn, so instead of feeling depressed or whatnot and poor self-esteem, I managed to use my position of being a bully victim to my advantage and "win" without throwing a single punch. It didn't work as nicely for all bullies as I got into several fights, some were in reaction to bullies, whereas others I more or less planned. Later, I wasn't a bully in that I'd physically attack anyone or use computers, more of psychological attacks, sometimes against bullies even if they weren't targeting me.

We're all biased on this topic of bullying and since you gave a very brief summary of your experiences, I gave a very brief summary of mine.


I can rip you off, and steal all your cash, suckerpunch you in the face, stand back and laugh. Leave you stranded as fast as a heart-attack.
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 07:50 AM

Just stating what my faith says really. And no, he was bisexual. Not full out Gay... plus there are some things in the Bible I refuse to back up.
Being Gay, yes you will go to hell, is it fair. No. I have gay/bi friends and I am bi myself, we'll go to hell. Simple as, but that doesn't make it fair.
Commit suicide, you'll go to hell, it's basically escaping life's trials.
Point, Judas commited suicide... he sold out Jesus, kissed him to sell him out (with is a sign of affection, but at the time it was the mark of death) ... he went to hell. Fair, yes. Look what he did.

No, this isn't fact, believe what you believe.

On topic, I doubt very much that an anti bullying law could work. What, do I now go hunting down my past bullyies to take them to court?

xx




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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 03:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmo View Post

Attitudes like this should have died out decades ago. There's no place for you in modern society.
You say to her that her attitude is terrible, and yet you tell her she should have "died out decades ago".

:/

I don't agree with what she said, but to expect others to be tolerant without tolerating them is impossible.

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Load it, check it, quick, rewrite it"
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 04:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glen Coco View Post

Being Gay, yes you will go to hell, is it fair. No. I have gay/bi friends and I am bi myself, we'll go to hell. Simple as, but that doesn't make it fair.
Commit suicide, you'll go to hell, it's basically escaping life's trials.
Just stop. Really. It's 2011, blindly believing in the bible was so 1950s.

Also, since we're using your beliefs as a focal point, if you've ever done any of the following:
Did anything on a Sunday
Gotten a haircut
Gotten anxious, angry, worried, or been lazy
Worn jeans
Prayed to an idol or an engraved image
Argued with people
Ate meat on a Friday

You'll be saying hi to him when you die.


Often I lie wide awake, thinking of things I could make.
But I donít seem to have the parts to build them.
I am so scared of what will kill me in the end, for I am not prepared.
I hope I will get the chance to be someone, to be human.






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  (#36 (permalink)) Old
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 05:05 PM

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Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
I never mentioned nor implied over-riding anything in that part of my post, so can you explain to me how you think I did?
I don't, and that wasn't what I was referring to. I was emphasising the fact that in order for someone to override the most basic survival instinct and go through with a suicide attempt, something pretty serious has to have happened. It was linked into the warning against trivialising its causes in the previous sentence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
You bring up a fair point, however, I addressed that in that part of the post you quoted by saying toughening up is the ideal outcome. For that reason, I do view bullying as "character building", although I admit, the process has many holes and isn't pleasant. I would say that ideally (with a capital I), bullying does make people toughen up AND others do jump in to stop before it gets too severe, so there's a bit of hurt but nothing too severe and damaging. I realize this ideal is far out of this world and rarely, if ever, happens in the present time.
I feel perhaps I should have been clearer - my objection is that this does not seem to me a remotely plausible outcome. I would say it is almost bordering on utopian. My experience with bullying was that when you do toughen up, the attempts to get a reaction simply become worse - and that, ultimately, is what bullying comes down to, getting a reaction and thereby demonstrating control. As far as "character building" is concerned, my experience was more of "character re-building" and happened long after the bullying itself stopped. As such, I do not feel this is realistic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
On a separate note, I'd say your bullying experience is like the majority's. Mine was only briefly like that as it then made a sharp turn, so instead of feeling depressed or whatnot and poor self-esteem, I managed to use my position of being a bully victim to my advantage and "win" without throwing a single punch. It didn't work as nicely for all bullies as I got into several fights, some were in reaction to bullies, whereas others I more or less planned. Later, I wasn't a bully in that I'd physically attack anyone or use computers, more of psychological attacks, sometimes against bullies even if they weren't targeting me.
All I can say in response to that is that you had what I would call a lucky escape. Unfortunately, due to a number of factors mine got worse as time went on and using my position as a bullying victim had little, if any, impact on the situation. Some people genuinely just don't care about the consequences of their actions in that regard.


"The greatest glory in living lies not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall." - Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

However bleak things seem, however insurmountable the darkness appears, remember that you have worth and nothing can take that away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OMFG!You'reActuallySmart! View Post
If you're referring to dr2005's response, it's not complex, however, he has a way with words .
RIP Nick
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 08:17 PM

At least Lady Gaga is DOING something!!

Even I'M trying to DO something. [GBH GUY]

But what are YOU doing? Criticizing? Is that your contribution to the world? Is there ANY chance of even one bullied victim being helped because of what YOU are DOING?

After reading MOST of the messages in this thread - I can't help but wonder if there is any hope at all.



PS If YOU are being bullied - I PROMISE YOU - there are LOTS of people who STILL CARE!
   
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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 26th 2011, 08:36 PM

Oh good grief. Bullying has not changed, people have been bullied for forever, the only evolvement is cyber bullying which is really easy enough to avoid. What has changed is for some reason these kids think that suicide is an option. I'm not sure when suicide became so attractive but as I said before I think the real problem we need to deal with here is that. Bullying sucks, most of us on here have been there and to say we don't care is highly incorrect. But the problem is more than just some kids saying mean things and playing mean pranks.


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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 27th 2011, 10:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadaCraig View Post
At least Lady Gaga is DOING something!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadaCraig View Post

Even I'M trying to DO something. [GBH GUY]

But what are YOU doing? Criticizing? Is that your contribution to the world? Is there ANY chance of even one bullied victim being helped because of what YOU are DOING?

After reading MOST of the messages in this thread - I can't help but wonder if there is any hope at all.



PS If YOU are being bullied - I PROMISE YOU - there are LOTS of people who STILL CARE!
o.o WTF did I do? EXCUSE ME for having religious beliefs and the nasty comments on my profile is just out of order.

Do you know what?! Mods, close this, obviously i'm to 'sick' and a bully Fucking ... blatantly I can't hold opinions, what do you want me to do, drop all my religious beliefs?! Oh yeah, that's simple

You don't agree, fine. You don't agree and attack my beliefs, not cool.




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Re: Bullies are criminals - September 27th 2011, 12:17 PM

Closed on user request + thread was getting out of hand.


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