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Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 05:45 PM

Reports coming in of gunmen on the Virgina Tech campus. I haven't heard much about it yet, but I just wondered if anyone from here goes there, or if anyone knows what's going on.

University spokesman has said that 2 people have been killed in the shooting, according to Reuters.





Last edited by Snufkin; December 8th 2011 at 05:51 PM.
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 06:56 PM

Here ya go!
http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/08/justic...html?hpt=us_c1

Basically... A gunman was stopped at a routine traffic stop outside of the Coliseum parking lot by McComas hall. The police officer who made the stop was shot and killed and the gunman went off on foot toward a parking lot known as "the Cage," where another victim was found dead.
Following that, more shots were reportedly heard near Torgersen which is a building across campus. The school is completely locked down right now, and evacuations are taking place in some of the buildings.

My sister is keeping me up-to-date (she's a student at VT, getting updates that are close to being in "realtime"), so I'll post as soon as I know more. Please keep the students, victims, and the gunman in your thoughts/prayers. VT has been through entirely too much, especially when it comes to shootings.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 07:09 PM

Jesus H Christ. Really?

So much for the fucking "gun-free zones". My money's on the guy being a drug dealer that the Campus police pulled over. And fo course, since most campus police are unarmed... yeah.

Anyway, I have the police scanner if anyone is interested.

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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 08:53 PM

Update! Press conference at 4:30 stated that there was no longer an immediate threat to students. A gun was recovered at the pond where the second victim was found. Activities on campus have resumed as normal.
More can be found on CNN or wsls.com.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 08:53 PM

Déjà vu...?


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 09:09 PM

New update: Law enforcement officials believe the gunman to be dead. It has not been confirmed or denied in the press conference.


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Last edited by TakeTheLeap; December 8th 2011 at 09:15 PM.
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 09:21 PM

Yep, looks like he's a goner http://abcnews.go.com/US/virginia-te...7#.TuE4S_K8C32




   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 09:26 PM

I was watching this on the news.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 09:31 PM

Unfortunately my first response to this was "Not again...". I'm not going to get into the gun ownership debate here because that's not appropriate right now, but it seems this is far too easy to do for all manner of reasons. Thoughts and prayers with all those affected.


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If you're referring to dr2005's response, it's not complex, however, he has a way with words .
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 09:45 PM

I just want to say that Its a tragic day once again.

I wish the best for the families of both.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 8th 2011, 09:54 PM

How horrible. I'm so sorry Virginia Tech, god that's just awful, to happen again.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 12:36 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr2005 View Post
Unfortunately my first response to this was "Not again...". I'm not going to get into the gun ownership debate here because that's not appropriate right now, but it seems this is far too easy to do for all manner of reasons. Thoughts and prayers with all those affected.
I'll save you the trouble. When someone makes the decision that they are going to acquire a firearm for use in a crime, no amount of registries, laws, or giant signs that say "gun-free zone" are going to stop him. This has been proven time and time again, and our response every time is to blame the tool instead of the user. Every time, these stupid emotional naive knee-jerk reactions come flooding out of the woodwork. And every time, we sit back in shock and wonder why it doesn't work. "oh, the laws just need to be stronger. Oh, we just need to ban guns. Oh, we'll just blah blah blah blah."

You cannot deny this fact. Gun-free zones and gun control laws DO NOT PREVENT THIS SHIT.

"oh it reduces the amount of-"
NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

If, as a country, we want to start taking actual steps to help end this shit, we have to get rid of the incredibly retarded stigma that blaming and therefor removing an inanimate object is going to stop people from doing this. I don't want to hear about gun crime statistics, I don't want to hear about how stabbings aren't as bad as shootings, I don't want to hear illogical utopian ideals about worldwide gun control.

I want to hear ideas about mental health screening. I want to hear ideas about reforming the process to get a gun so that it is more efficient and safe in the sense that one uniform method can be used across the country to determine to should and should not carry a firearm, instead of 50 different methods, or lack there of, of ways make people swim through a bureaucratic, and obviously FAILING method of gun control.

Prohibition did not stop booze. The war on drugs has not stopped drugs. Banning guns will not stop gun crimes.

Until people wake up and smell the bullshit, these kinds of things are going to keep happening.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 12:49 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerTank77 View Post
I'll save you the trouble. When someone makes the decision that they are going to acquire a firearm for use in a crime, no amount of registries, laws, or giant signs that say "gun-free zone" are going to stop him. This has been proven time and time again, and our response every time is to blame the tool instead of the user. Every time, these stupid emotional naive knee-jerk reactions come flooding out of the woodwork. And every time, we sit back in shock and wonder why it doesn't work. "oh, the laws just need to be stronger. Oh, we just need to ban guns. Oh, we'll just blah blah blah blah."

You cannot deny this fact. Gun-free zones and gun control laws DO NOT PREVENT THIS SHIT.

"oh it reduces the amount of-"
NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

If, as a country, we want to start taking actual steps to help end this shit, we have to get rid of the incredibly retarded stigma that blaming and therefor removing an inanimate object is going to stop people from doing this. I don't want to hear about gun crime statistics, I don't want to hear about how stabbings aren't as bad as shootings, I don't want to hear illogical utopian ideals about worldwide gun control.

I want to hear ideas about mental health screening. I want to hear ideas about reforming the process to get a gun so that it is more efficient and safe in the sense that one uniform method can be used across the country to determine to should and should not carry a firearm, instead of 50 different methods, or lack there of, of ways make people swim through a bureaucratic, and obviously FAILING method of gun control.

Prohibition did not stop booze. The war on drugs has not stopped drugs. Banning guns will not stop gun crimes.

Until people wake up and smell the bullshit, these kinds of things are going to keep happening.
It's not about stopping it, it's about reducing it. And any reduction is better than no reduction, to deny that is stupid.
And you don't want to hear about statistics? Surely the statistics prove someone's point?

Alcohol is too easy to make for them to be able to ban it. And drugs are highly addictive, not that you can use it as a reason anyway unless you have evidence to show that the rate of people on drugs is the same as or lower than it is currently in places where they're legal?
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 01:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobies View Post

It's not about stopping it, it's about reducing it. And any reduction is better than no reduction, to deny that is stupid.
And you don't want to hear about statistics? Surely the statistics prove someone's point?

Alcohol is too easy to make for them to be able to ban it. And drugs are highly addictive, not that you can use it as a reason anyway unless you have evidence to show that the rate of people on drugs is the same as or lower than it is currently in places where they're legal?
Statistics? Okay, I've got statistics for you!
I wrote a paper a few years back in relation to gun laws. This statistic came from a cute little town called Kennesaw, GA. They passed an ordinance requiring there to be a gun in each household. The year it was passed (1982), only one gun crime was committed and it happened between two out-of-staters at a hotel. Crime rates dropped significantly after the law was passed, and they have managed to stay at that low level. Now, Kennesaw's population has increased since then, so rates have gone up slightly, but for a city its size, they still have the lowest crime rate in the country.

Now, for the numbers... In 1981, the crime rate was 11 burlaries per 1,000 residents. By 1998, Kennesaw's burglary rate was 243 per 100,000 residents (or .243 per 1,000). In a comparable city such as Decatur (same population size), crime rate was 4,094 property crimes per 100,000.
(citation: http://www.rense.com/general9/gunlaw.htm)
Not a single murder has occurred in Kennesaw since the ordinance was passed.

The ordinance was passed in response to a citywide gun ban in Morton Grove, IL. I'm sure you can guess where the statistics were going with this.... GUNS BANNED. NO MORE CRIME?! Nope, sorry. Immediately following the gun ban, crime rates rose by a significant 15.7%.

Here's another article that says the same thing I just went over (basically), but this one is from 2007. http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=41196

There are your statistics. Now. The only "gun control" I want is the control I have as I pull the trigger.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 01:30 AM

^^ It's a nice thought, but see the problem is that is that even if they do have screening tests like that, only the people who legally buy guns and get licenses would go through the tests. The most dangerous people -- gang members, drug dealers, school shooters, etc. -- would get a hold of weapons through the black market, so it wouldn't affect them. It's actually been proven that when guns are allowed to everyone, the crime rate is lowered because the "powerful" criminals are suddenly a lot less powerful now that everyone has a gun just like them. Otherwise, the innocent are left defenseless and those who illegally obtain firearms and plan on using them in illegal, violent ways have nothing stopping them.

This is so sad though, and my heart goes out to everyone involved today. I'm so sorry for the two men whose lives ended so abruptly and horribly and for the tragic mess that that man who shot them must have been.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 01:32 AM

Quote:
Statistics? Okay, I've got statistics for you!
I wrote a paper a few years back in relation to gun laws. This statistic came from a cute little town called Kennesaw, GA. They passed an ordinance requiring there to be a gun in each household. The year it was passed (1982), only one gun crime was committed and it happened between two out-of-staters at a hotel. Crime rates dropped significantly after the law was passed, and they have managed to stay at that low level. Now, Kennesaw's population has increased since then, so rates have gone up slightly, but for a city its size, they still have the lowest crime rate in the country.

Now, for the numbers... In 1981, the crime rate was 11 burlaries per 1,000 residents. By 1998, Kennesaw's burglary rate was 243 per 100,000 residents (or .243 per 1,000). In a comparable city such as Decatur (same population size), crime rate was 4,094 property crimes per 100,000.
(citation: http://www.rense.com/general9/gunlaw.htm)
Not a single murder has occurred in Kennesaw since the ordinance was passed.

The ordinance was passed in response to a citywide gun ban in Morton Grove, IL. I'm sure you can guess where the statistics were going with this.... GUNS BANNED. NO MORE CRIME?! Nope, sorry. Immediately following the gun ban, crime rates rose by a significant 15.7%.

Here's another article that says the same thing I just went over (basically), but this one is from 2007. http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=41196

There are your statistics. Now. The only "gun control" I want is the control I have as I pull the trigger.
I guess you posted this as I was typing, but yeah, that's what I was talking about when I said it's been proven that everyone having guns lowers crime and trying to control guns just increases it.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 01:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobies View Post


It's not about stopping it, it's about reducing it. And any reduction is better than no reduction, to deny that is stupid.
Reducing it isn't good enough. Anyone who is genuinely okay with "more stabbings" or "slightly less gun crime" is delusional.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobies View Post

And you don't want to hear about statistics? Surely the statistics prove someone's point?
Because generally, the statistics have proven that gun control =/= crime control. For every statistic thrown out by both sides, there always an exception that completely flies in the face of whatever point is trying to be made.

Example-
Give everyone guns!= Somalia
Guns always cause crime!= Switzerland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boobies View Post
Alcohol is too easy to make for them to be able to ban it. And drugs are highly addictive, not that you can use it as a reason anyway unless you have evidence to show that the rate of people on drugs is the same as or lower than it is currently in places where they're legal?
And trying to ban something that has been engraved in American society since the revolutionary war as a symbol of freedom is going to just go so smoothly right?

Lets say, tomorrow, we wake up, and every registered gun, or every gun in the system (I.E- the legal ones) is suddenly gone. Guns are banned. Now what?

"Well then only criminals would have guns."

That's right. Suddenly, we have a completely disarmed populace, an armed populace of criminals with illegal, unregistered (and essentially invisible) weaponry, and a police force that isn't even legally obligated to actually protect your personal safety.

(See "Castle Rock V. Gonzalez" and "Warren V. District of Columbia")

What happens then? Increased robbery. Increased burglary. Increased armed assault. Increased Rape. Increased Homicides. Decreased personal safety. Decreased property values. Decreased liberty. Increased oppression.

You have an unchecked armed criminal network and armed police going at each other. Incarceration skyrockets. police patrols and heavily armed police presence goes up, and thus police shootings and the # of dead policemen go up. Gun deaths, over all, go up.

A black market for illegal weaponry springs up almost overnight, as we have seen with prohibition and the war on drugs. With innocent, unarmed, and defenseless civilians in the crossfire, unable to do anything except pray to god that the people in their house don't actually want to kill them, or that the cops arrive in time.

Sound like a good idea? Not even in the slightest.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 01:46 AM

Funny, 'cause the first thing I thought when I saw this story, was a sarcastic statement of "But guns are banned on campus, how on earth did this happen?!" The guy was a drug dealer - do you think they obtain their firearms legally?

Gun control can work, I'm not going to deny that. I'm too lazy to dig up the sources and statistics from my research paper, but when Canada enforced the same level of gun control as the US in the 60's and 70's their gun crime was parallel to each other. Enforcing stricter control over firearms brought it down exponentially.

Ben is completely right in that 'gun free zones' don't work. Chicago, New York City, DC, all have the strictest gun control you can possible have - you are not allowed to own a gun, no matter what. By theory, these cities would be extremely safe, but the reality is each year they top the list with the highest gun crime in the country.

An increase of federal gun control is a possibility, but there are still other issues. The United States has extreme problems with gun smuggling from Mexico, as well as a huge amount of illegal firearms already floating around the country. That's what differentiates the US from other countries in this, besides firearms being so engrained in their society. Enforcing strict gun control - you would potentially get a drop in gun crime, but at the expense of millions of legal gun owners being able to properly defend themselves, as well as recreational uses gone. Small concentrates, like the cities listed above have proved the strictest gun control actually increases gun crime for whatever reasons. Maybe loose gun control deters criminal behavior. The argument is that, is the trade off worth it? Most people who know their stuff about this seem to think no. It's extremely rare to see an anti-gun advocate who isn't completely ignorant of what they're trying to do, besides the typical "duh, gun go's bang, kills, very scary".
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 02:22 AM

Those scum who feel the need to pull out guns on unarmed people only do it because they are cowards, and wouldn't face unarmed people without a gun otherwise. Once they're aware that others also carry guns... it makes sense that they'd be less trigger happy in fear of immediate consequences.

I'm beginning to lean towards "legalizing" guns, although I don't think in the UK yet. Gun crime isn't high enough around here for me to feel the need to own one to defend myself.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 03:02 AM

Damn... Michigan has to play Virginia Tech in the Sugar Bowl.
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 03:50 AM

Quote:
Those scum who feel the need to pull out guns on unarmed people only do it because they are cowards, and wouldn't face unarmed people without a gun otherwise.
those scum are real people too. he had a family, you know. he was someone's son. you don't know his story and what disorders he may have had or what he was struggling with or what his life was like or what sort of genetic quirk he may have had that caused his brain to behave so irrationally. I'm not trying to justify killing anyone, because there is no justification for that, but I'm just saying, he's still a person, and dehumanizing him and others like him by calling them "scum" just adds to the cruelty and lack of compassion that is already so present in this terrible situation. As I said before, it's tragic, and the inhumane response by the general public is tragic too.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 04:51 AM

Just to clear somethings up... What happened was:
-VA Officer was conducting a traffic stop
-3rd party came up and killed the officer
-3rd partly fled
-VA Trooper found 3rd party
-VA Trooper attempted to arrest, was shot, then Troop nutralized the suspect.

Kinda irnoic this all happened while top VA Tech brass was in DC attempting to dismiss a fine the feds put on them for the crap that happened on 07'.
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 05:26 AM

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Originally Posted by BDF View Post
I'm beginning to lean towards "legalizing" guns, although I don't think in the UK yet. Gun crime isn't high enough around here for me to feel the need to own one to defend myself.
If guns ever become legal in the UK, I'm out of here.




   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 05:49 AM

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If guns ever become legal in the UK, I'm out of here.
They are legal. Just heavily, heavily restricted.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 06:22 AM

What a hipster, trying to take a classic and relive it.

Is what I would say if I were trolling.

Seriously though, maybe doing things like arming guards, and allowing armed students would help prevent this kind of idiocy from repeating itself.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 06:26 AM

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Originally Posted by Guile View Post
What a hipster, trying to take a classic and relive it.

Is what I would say if I were trolling.

Seriously though, maybe doing things like arming guards, and allowing armed students would help prevent this kind of idiocy from repeating itself.
VT Police are Armed... but the VT's college board is also.. dare I say... retarded. As are most college boards.
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 06:50 AM

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Originally Posted by -A- View Post
Just to clear somethings up... What happened was:
-VA Officer was conducting a traffic stop
-3rd party came up and killed the officer
-3rd partly fled
-VA Trooper found 3rd party
-VA Trooper attempted to arrest, was shot, then Troop nutralized the suspect.
Incorrect.
-Virginia Tech police officer was conducting a routine traffic stop at Coliseum parking lot
-While in his vehicle, 3rd party approached the scene and killed the VT Cop
-3rd party fled and headed toward McComas hall
-Virginia police officer (not campus police) spotted a suspicious person heading near the Cage
-2nd victim found at the Cage parking lot, deceased. Weapon was recovered in the same area as the 2nd victim
-Police identified 2nd victim as the suspect who killed VT officer. They have stated they cannot say definitively, but feel confident that they have located the shooter.

There is believed to be a link between the shooting and a Radford University armed robbery that occurred yesterday, but there is no clear motive.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 08:34 AM

This whole situation is so sad. It’s never acceptable for something like this to happen, but I feel like the last shooting was just yesterday. Thoughts and prayers to the friends and families of the people involved =(


   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 9th 2011, 05:23 PM

Honestly, if the person were to do a re-make, they should at least give a good effort. 2 deaths compared to 33? The guy is riding the coat-tails of Cho.

But in all seriousness, when I read through the thread, all I thought was, "again... what's going at at VT that makes these shooters or is it just shit luck of the draw?"


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 10th 2011, 07:27 PM

New information has been released about the shooter. He has been identified as Ross Truett Ashley of Partlow, VA, and a part-time student at Radford University (about 15 minutes down the road from VT). Ashley has been identified by Radford police as the person responsible for the armed robbery of a 2011 Mercedes SUV on Dec. 7th (the day before the murder-suicide). There has not yet been a connection made between Ashley and the victim, VT Police Officer Deriek Crouse, and the investigation will continue.

http://www2.wsls.com/news/2011/dec/0...ed-ar-1533359/


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 11th 2011, 10:08 AM

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Originally Posted by TigerTank77 View Post
I'll save you the trouble. When someone makes the decision that they are going to acquire a firearm for use in a crime, no amount of registries, laws, or giant signs that say "gun-free zone" are going to stop him. This has been proven time and time again, and our response every time is to blame the tool instead of the user. Every time, these stupid emotional naive knee-jerk reactions come flooding out of the woodwork. And every time, we sit back in shock and wonder why it doesn't work. "oh, the laws just need to be stronger. Oh, we just need to ban guns. Oh, we'll just blah blah blah blah."

You cannot deny this fact. Gun-free zones and gun control laws DO NOT PREVENT THIS SHIT.

"oh it reduces the amount of-"
NOT GOOD ENOUGH.

If, as a country, we want to start taking actual steps to help end this shit, we have to get rid of the incredibly retarded stigma that blaming and therefor removing an inanimate object is going to stop people from doing this. I don't want to hear about gun crime statistics, I don't want to hear about how stabbings aren't as bad as shootings, I don't want to hear illogical utopian ideals about worldwide gun control.

I want to hear ideas about mental health screening. I want to hear ideas about reforming the process to get a gun so that it is more efficient and safe in the sense that one uniform method can be used across the country to determine to should and should not carry a firearm, instead of 50 different methods, or lack there of, of ways make people swim through a bureaucratic, and obviously FAILING method of gun control.

Prohibition did not stop booze. The war on drugs has not stopped drugs. Banning guns will not stop gun crimes.

Until people wake up and smell the bullshit, these kinds of things are going to keep happening.
First off, I was actually trying to avoid bringing the gun ownership debate into the thread because, as I said, it's not appropriate. The reason I mentioned it at all was to try and pre-empt it rearing its head and put people off mentioning it - and unfortunately the above has completely nixed that. Next time I say something like "I'm not going to get into the gun ownership debate", bear in mind it may be for the reasons I just mentioned. Second, by "gun ownership debate" I was referring to the situation as a whole, not the legislative response to it, as there are wider issues of ease of supply outside of the legislative framework. Third, if we are really going to go over the gun ownership debate I can quite easily raise the example of my own country (the UK) which has some of the strictest gun ownership laws currently in force and also one of the lowest gun-related death rates. However, this has already been sidetracked enough so I propose to go no further - other than to agree with you that there are many elements about gun control laws at present which need significant overhaul.

Anyway, hopefully more will come to light about this as the investigation continues.


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If you're referring to dr2005's response, it's not complex, however, he has a way with words .
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 11th 2011, 02:40 PM

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Originally Posted by Dr. Gregory House View Post
Incorrect.
What you said..
Ah crap.. >_< yeah I was wrong.. Apperently they were two differnt shootings I was hearing about.
   
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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 11th 2011, 10:39 PM

Revolutionist without a cause. What a terrible act of domestic terrorism.

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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 13th 2011, 02:49 AM

A (hopefully) final update from the news.... Officer Deriek Crouse's funeral was held at Virginia Tech today (My sister got to work the setting up, running, and breaking down of the funeral... How cool is that?!) with hundreds of people from the VT community in attendance as well as many of Crouse's most special family, friends, and colleagues.

We remember Officer Crouse as a devoted husband, father, and brother, as well as a hero, killed in the line of duty. Here's the video for the event. I'm so glad that Officer Crouse had an amazing turnout, and that true respect and love was shown to his family. I'm so proud of the Hokie Nation and the amount of compassion that has been shown since the awful events of December 8th. Good job, Hokies. <3


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 13th 2011, 08:14 AM

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Originally Posted by The Man And XX Master View Post
Honestly, if the person were to do a re-make, they should at least give a good effort. 2 deaths compared to 33? The guy is riding the coat-tails of Cho.

But in all seriousness, when I read through the thread, all I thought was, "again... what's going at at VT that makes these shooters or is it just shit luck of the draw?"
Yeah, that's what I was wondering... Although this shooting wasn't a 'massacre' like the one involving Cho, I was still rather surprised that it was once again Virginia Tech. I mean, what's happening over there?


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 13th 2011, 08:56 AM

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Originally Posted by Carpe Diem View Post
Yeah, that's what I was wondering... Although this shooting wasn't a 'massacre' like the one involving Cho, I was still rather surprised that it was once again Virginia Tech. I mean, what's happening over there?
Actually, the shooter was a part-time student at Radford University who had committed an armed robbery of a Mercedes SUV the day before. The SUV was found abandoned near Tech's campus, where the proper authorities were notified. There is -some- kind of link between these two events, but the motives aren't clear and I'm not sure they ever will be.

As a person who has grown up with VT right at her back door and have several friends and family attending the institution, I would say the only "problem" is that some students can't handle the academic pressure, but that is true on any college campus. One could argue that there is a lack of personal relationships between professors and students, but that is also true at any big university.
I don't think I could pinpoint anything that's going on at the school to actively cause events like this to occur. From what I have seen, VT, even for the population, is a very close knit school. Seeing all of the students come together after the massacre and even after the shooting last week, it's quite motivational.


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Re: Virgina Tech gunmen - December 13th 2011, 07:05 PM

the recent event wasn't a school shooting, people just got scared because it was near/on the campus of VT, and the history of VT and people with guns. If this had happened near any other university, it wouldn't be tied in with school shootings--it would simply be a guy who committed an armed robbery, murdered a police officer, and shot himself, and wouldn't have as much media coverage. I don't think there's anything going on with VT specifically, I think it's just the associations going on in our minds and with the media.


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