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Religion and Spirituality, Science and Philosophy Use this forum to discuss what you believe in. This is a place where everyone may share their views freely.

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harley Offline
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Post I do Not agree - April 5th 2011, 05:19 AM

Lately my mom has been forcing me to church and this past Sunday our archbishop sent all of the churches a letter to remind us what a roman catholic is and within that letter he said that it is not right for LGBT to get married (im not gay but i still don't agree with it) at all also he contradicts him self by saying that god is forgiving but if you have a same sex marriage you will go straight to hell. the letter never said anything about suicide or anything but i know that it is a mortal sin that will send me straight to hell. there are a number of different issues that i have with the catholic church but those to are the biggest and this is getting too long but i was wondering how do i tell my mom that i don't want to go or get confirmed etc. i tried telling her before about a year ago but she blew up! PLEASE HELP!!! I CANT STAND IT ANY MORE lol all and any views are appreciated


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Re: I do Not agree - April 5th 2011, 06:53 AM

I'm not sure what is done during confirmation but just tell your mother you refuse and give her reasons why. Chances are since she blew up before, she'll do the same again so there's probably no way avoiding her getting angry. You could cite some passages from the bible to calm her down. I suppose if you keep telling her and if she's the type of Catholic that is able to have a civil discussion, then have one. However, if she's the type that is unable to, keep going at it in asking if you two can have a civil open-minded conversation until she agrees.

If you are willing to, try talking to the priest or archbishop expressing your views both on not wanting to be confirmed and on the issues mentioned in the letter. If possible, have a group meeting with the archbishop or priest, mother, any other immediate family or good friends and yourself.


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Re: I do Not agree - April 5th 2011, 08:32 AM

They cannot force you to be confirmed. Part of confirmation is that you're old enough to make the decision for yourself. Baptism, Communion... you are usually too young to object or actually understand what you're doing (particularly with baptism if you're a baby, obviously, but personally I was baptised at about 5).

Anyway, I chose to not be confirmed. I was 11 (I think) at the time. It didn't bother my mother as she was more... non practicing... I think it bothered other members of my extended family but I didn't see them that often and no body really made a big deal out of it. I went to a catholic school so it was a little harder to deal with that.

It must be a lot harder in your situation coming from a extremely religious family, but my point is, forcing someone to get confirmed defeats the purpose. If I were you I'd tell your mum that it's fine for her to believe what she wants, but you don't, and you've decided not to get confirmed. Not that you don't want too, not asking her if you have to, but telling her you're not going too. Don't yell, scream etc even if she does, because she won't take you seriously if you start ranting and raving about how unfair everything is opposed to just telling her calmly that you don't believe.

Good luck with everything.


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Re: I do Not agree - April 5th 2011, 12:34 PM

Does the Bishop believe that God created people? If so, why would he make some people gay if it was wrong? Sometimes I think the entire Church is just an institution to control and brainwash people.


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Re: I do Not agree - April 5th 2011, 04:05 PM

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Originally Posted by Sythan View Post
Does the Bishop believe that God created people? If so, why would he make some people gay if it was wrong? Sometimes I think the entire Church is just an institution to control and brainwash people.
SOMETIMES??

Wow... where have you been the last 2000 years...

Jesus Christ > The Church

A religion which does not adhere to it's core values and founding principles fails it's people.

The purpose of the following is to help you feel better about your choice to not be confirmed...

"Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself." (BIBLE, Leviticus 19:18)
The church and governments founded in the church's name has been responsible for more treachery and subjugation than any other establishment in history.
"It is more blessed to give than to receive." (BIBLE, Acts 20:35)
Yet in many denominations of Christianity, the members of the church are OBLIGATED to give a percentage of their earnings to the church. The church is simply an extortionist who's benefactors get rich and fat off of others hard work.
"Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it." (BIBLE, Proverbs 22:6)I'm not even going to bring up molestation - too easy."Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it." (BIBLE, Hebrews 13:2)
Oh, Really? Throughout history - Christians have waged more pointless wars for greed and gold than any other religious entity - they have killed entire civilizations of strangers for their gold, all in the name of god. I bet if Christ were here today, he would surely spit on the church in it's current form and call for the entire system to be brought down for a return to what he actually taught.


A good example of what's been done in the name of the church: Bartolome De Las Casas: A short account of the destruction of the Indies. Please, Read this if you doubt the hypocrisy and corruptness of the Church.

The above example is one of hundreds - Perpetrated for god and country, for the church, and praised by the church for bringing it riches and power.


"Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light". (BIBLE, 2 Corinthians 11:14)

I argue that as soon as 100 years after Christ's death, agents of "Satan" had already infiltrated the "Christian Church" and began leading it's blind masses to the cruel and corrupt means that they subjugate and torture the earths populations with false promise of salvation.
"Love your enemies." (BIBLE, Matthew 5:44)
The only love that any who have ever stood against the church have received - is the taste of cold steel, a Hangman's rope, Suffocation and drowning, the scorch of flames as they are burned alive, and the pain of bearing witness to their Families being raped and ravaged before them, only to be powerless to help them... to inevitably be put to death themselves.


All in the name of the church.



So Good sir, I do say - stand up to the zealots, and if anything - embrace the teachings of Jesus Christ, But tell the Christian Church to F**K Off, for as Gandhi said.
"I Like your Christ, I do not like your Christians, they are not like your Christ." -Gandhi


People should be free to their own beliefs without being forced into a mold by a self-interested religious Hierarchy.




/rant.


Any who, That's my opinion.
The roman catholic sect of the church really has a bleak view on life, what with it's original sin and all. Psh, Defect to some other place that dosent have you being damned to hell from birth. lol


As for your mom, she really cant force you. Public compliance without private acceptance might be the best route to take at your age though.








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Last edited by Smitten; April 5th 2011 at 04:07 PM. Reason: The point
   
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Re: I do Not agree - April 5th 2011, 04:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sythan View Post
Does the Bishop believe that God created people? If so, why would he make some people gay if it was wrong? Sometimes I think the entire Church is just an institution to control and brainwash people.
I'd have given a nice long post but Smitten has already beaten me to the draw. Instead, I'll keep it short (something I'm terrible at). If you think "sometimes" the church is for control and brain-washing, then you're brain-washed. Look at the basic philosophy of Christianity: go along, do as god says or be punished severe out of proportion. If you believe, you're fine but if you don't, you're doomed. If you believe, you submit yourself to strictly following a set of guidelines and the only reason to stay following is out of fear or too deluded to put down the bible even when going to sleep.


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Re: I do Not agree - April 6th 2011, 06:56 AM

thank you for posting everyone but before i make a decision i would like to hear some more points of view from anyone or from any religion


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Re: I do Not agree - April 6th 2011, 09:07 AM

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thank you for posting everyone but before i make a decision i would like to hear some more points of view from anyone or from any religion
I would suggest seeking out Christian members like Kitty if you want that point of view.


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Re: I do Not agree - April 6th 2011, 05:06 PM

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Originally Posted by Sythan View Post
I would suggest seeking out Christian members like Kitty if you want that point of view.
Yeah, there are some heavily Christian members on this site who tend to shy away from threads that openly bash their faith, not that I blame them for doing so. You may want to go looking for someone and PM them for their point of view.


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Re: I do Not agree - April 6th 2011, 05:55 PM

I'm Christian. Lutheran. Really long story, but it turns out they accept gays and violence and really other than the ten comandments, no rules (No killing, No Stealing, Ect.)
Lutherans also believe that no one is damned to hell based on one action, but their entire life. Even so if they have a good heart and soul, they will not go to hell. Being gay isn't even in the equation. It's like

A + B = C, If you added: a + b + being gay = C it just doesn't make sense, does it?

Also no believing in a certain religion is your choice. Your mother has no right to make you believe it, you could even contact child services in which case she could no punish you and you would not have to.
   
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Re: I do Not agree - April 7th 2011, 01:18 AM

I'm not Christian, but I will try my utmost to give you a nice, neutral viewpoint on this.

Your church may or may not be corrupt. Sometimes you find good, honest churches, so I'm not going to start ranting off at you for going to church because you may actually want to and enjoy going to church (yes, I'm looking at you, Smitten and Wow, though I'm not going to quarrel at you two either, for those are pretty much the reasons why I left Christianity).

Sometimes it's best, in your situation, to present the facts to your mother. Tell her that while you're not objecting to confirmation in the future, you don't feel personally ready for it at the moment, and you don't want to go through confirmation until you have a deeper relationship with Jesus. And about not going to church, ask her if you may do your prayers/et cetera in private instead, to begin on that journey to a closer relationship and thus leading to a nearer confirmation. In other other words, I'm saying read the Bible, pick out some verses that support your decisions in your mother's light, memorize them by heart, and quote them at her like the day is long when she objects. She'll be speechless, and you'll have a good reason in her eyes for not wanting to go to church or be confirmed.

If you can't resist the current, go with the flow. That is to say, if you can't just say 'I'm not going because I don't want to,' then say 'I'm not going because I feel I need to reflect on my sins and furthermore seek Jesus before I confirm'.


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1. Do what you want within the bounds of reason, whenever you want to, and regret nothing. 2. If you have an opinion, don't beat around the bush, or there isn't a point in saying it. 3. Don't keep the company of anyone who won't like you and will try to change you.



   
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