TeenHelp
Support Forums Today's Posts


Get Advice Connect with TeenHelp Resources
HelpLINK Facebook     Twitter     Tumblr Hotlines

You are not registered or have not logged in

Hello guest! (Not a guest? Log in above!)

As a guest on TeenHelp you are only able to use some of our site's features. By registering an account you will be able to enjoy unlimited access to our site, and will be able to:

Signing up is free, anonymous and will only take a few moments, so click here to register now!



Religion and Spirituality, Science and Philosophy Use this forum to discuss what you believe in. This is a place where everyone may share their views freely.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  (#1 (permalink)) Old
snappydog Offline
Whimsical Nocturne
Average Joe
***
 
snappydog's Avatar
 
Name: Chris
Age: 20
Gender: Male
Location: Exeter

Posts: 135
Join Date: October 31st 2009

A (not so) quick question... - February 9th 2012, 09:59 PM

Directed largely at the believers (of any religion):
You believe in... well, let's say you're Christian. So you believe in the Christian God. But you don't believe in any other god, so Allah, Shiva, Zeus, Thor, they're all out of it.
Presumably you believe in whichever god you believe in for a reason, but I was wondering:

Why that/those god/God/gods and not any other?

Let's take it a bit further and concentrate on the second bit: Why don't you believe in any of those other gods? There must be a reason that you believe in your god, and equally there must be a reason that you don't believe in the others - otherwise you wouldn't believe in the one/s you do and not the ones you don't.
But how do you know that any of the gods you don't believe in don't exist?
I may as well cut straight to it:

Can you prove that all gods other than that/ those in which you believe do not exist, using logic which cannot be used to prove that your god/s does/ do not exist?

Because if you can, then fantastic.
If not... then there's two possible explanations.
One, you can't prove that any gods don't exist, in which case any or all of them could, in which case which one should any of us believe in?
Two, you can prove that none of them don't exist, in which case... well.

I'm just interested to see the response to this, so... thanks.


It's no surprise that you'll soon forget about me
   
  (#2 (permalink)) Old
eunoia Offline
(n) beautiful thinking
Jeez, get a life!
***********
 
eunoia's Avatar
 
Name: Jes
Age: 25
Gender: Female
Location: USA

Posts: 5,893
Join Date: January 5th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 9th 2012, 10:48 PM

You have (seemingly intentionally, but forgive me if I am wrong regarding that) to have set this question up so no one can "win," so to say. Of course no one can prove the existence of a higher being. The very essence of faith is believing in something without proof.



Someday I will be strong enough to lift not one but both of us.
I told you to be patient
I told you to be fine
I told you to be balanced
I told you to be kind
   
1 user(s) liked this post or found it helpful.
  (#3 (permalink)) Old
snappydog Offline
Whimsical Nocturne
Average Joe
***
 
snappydog's Avatar
 
Name: Chris
Age: 20
Gender: Male
Location: Exeter

Posts: 135
Join Date: October 31st 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 9th 2012, 10:51 PM

I'm not asking anyone to prove anything does exist, I understand that the existence of a deity is something which has to be taken without proof. My question was directed towards proving whether something does NOT exist, which... Well, I figure that if you can't prove it does exist, you have to at least be able to reason that it doesn't not exist, so to speak.


It's no surprise that you'll soon forget about me
   
  (#4 (permalink)) Old
Brandon Offline
Member
I can't get enough
*********
 
Brandon's Avatar
 
Age: 24
Gender: ♂
Location: ☼ A t l a n t a ☼

Posts: 2,454
Join Date: January 6th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 9th 2012, 11:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by snappydog View Post
Why that/those god/God/gods and not any other?
Well, why do I believe that dragons have existed in time, but unicorns haven't? Well, I think dragons are awesome, therefore I believe they existed. I don't need any sort of evidence (granted, I'm sure there is evidence out there) to explain why I would believe in something. The only reason that really matters is...well...because I can, really. My mind is capable of believing in something without needing credible evidence. So let's say that I'm a Christian (I'm not)...why would I believe in the Christian god and not other gods? Because my mind likes the idea of the Christian god being a god rather than Zeus, or anything else.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snappydog View Post
Let's take it a bit further and concentrate on the second bit: Why don't you believe in any of those other gods?
As I mentioned above, it's just that our minds seek a preference on a belief. Because humans differ from one another, these preferences differ.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snappydog View Post
There must be a reason that you believe in your god, and equally there must be a reason that you don't believe in the others - otherwise you wouldn't believe in the one/s you do and not the ones you don't.
But how do you know that any of the gods you don't believe in don't exist?
You don't know. The argument works both ways...you may question...well, how do you know they don't exist? What would you say if I asked the same thing? You simply don't know, but the beauty about believing in something is that you don't need any evidence to support your belief. If I were a Christian, I wouldn't believe in Zeus because I don't really agree with the idea of a god like Zeus.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snappydog View Post
Can you prove that all gods other than that/ those in which you believe do not exist, using logic which cannot be used to prove that your god/s does/ do not exist?
Well, let me ask you this...do you have anything to prove that someone else's god(s) doesn't exist? You may say that "well, I can't see any gods, haven't had any interaction with any gods" doesn't prove anything either. Both sides of the argument have no credible evidence. I can't prove to you that the Christian god is real, but you can't prove that the Christian god isn't real. Otherwise, we would've settled this "religion vs. science" debate a long ass time ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snappydog View Post
One, you can't prove that any gods don't exist, in which case any or all of them could, in which case which one should any of us believe in?
And that's the thing about having faith in something. It's like those hollywood movies that express someone having faith in someone when it seemed that all hope was lost, and they'd change their life and the person would say "I've always had faith in you." Blindside, for example...a woman had faith in someone. From a standard perspective, people could argue that there wasn't any point in having faith in the person in the first place. She didn't know for certain that things would get better with him, but she had enough faith to not give up. No, you don't know whether the other gods are real or not, but if you believe in something and have faith in that belief, you're saying that...hey, I'm not going to exclude the possibility of other gods being real, but what I feel is that the Christian god is real because I have faith in the Christian god. If you're wrong, you're wrong. But at the end of the day, everyone has potential for being wrong. I would think that I would stand a higher chance in ending up believing in the right god compared to an Atheist, wouldn't you say?



"I may not be smart, but I am stupid." - Brandon

Got a question and want brutal honesty? PM me!
  Send a message via MSN to Brandon Send a message via Yahoo to Brandon Send a message via Skype™ to Brandon 
  (#5 (permalink)) Old
eunoia Offline
(n) beautiful thinking
Jeez, get a life!
***********
 
eunoia's Avatar
 
Name: Jes
Age: 25
Gender: Female
Location: USA

Posts: 5,893
Join Date: January 5th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 10th 2012, 12:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by snappydog View Post
I'm not asking anyone to prove anything does exist, I understand that the existence of a deity is something which has to be taken without proof. My question was directed towards proving whether something does NOT exist, which... Well, I figure that if you can't prove it does exist, you have to at least be able to reason that it doesn't not exist, so to speak.
It's the same thing. The existence of God is theory, not fact--or at least not fact as we know it. Proof implies factual knowledge, and thus proof on either side of the religious debate (there is a God/there isn't) would be the final word on the matter.

The reasons we cannot prove the existence of a higher power are the same reasons we cannot prove the absence of one: we just don't know. And so instead we believe based on faith alone.



Someday I will be strong enough to lift not one but both of us.
I told you to be patient
I told you to be fine
I told you to be balanced
I told you to be kind
   
  (#6 (permalink)) Old
"Bisexual" Tux (Linux Mascot)
I've been here a while
********
 
Loving Linux Penguin's Avatar
 
Name: Chris
Age: 18
Gender: Male
Location: SF Bay Area

Posts: 1,542
Join Date: December 27th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 10th 2012, 12:56 AM

One could argue, however, that since almost all religions say the same things about their god(s) and have very similar beliefs about them (you must only worship our's etc.), that they are not in fact different gods, but the same ones referred to differently. Just pointing that out.


Chris
You can always contact me to talk about anything!
---------------------
Proud to be myself.

Need a hug? Please take one!
Associate HelpLINK Mentor (with LiveHelp access)

Image Credit: startingover18 (Tumblr)


Here's a thanks to the really cool guy that helped me face fear and make a wonderful change in my life!
last updated on 4/26/14
   
  (#7 (permalink)) Old
Megan1 Offline
Member
Senior TeenHelper
*******
 
Megan1's Avatar
 
Name: Megan
Gender: Female
Location: USA

Posts: 932
Join Date: February 6th 2010

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 10th 2012, 03:10 PM

Mainly, faith (the assurance of things not seen). I didn't go searching through different religions to figure out which one had more "proof". God drew me to Him on His own, and by faith, I beleived.

And if I believe that my God's word is true, I believe that the other gods aren't true, because my God's word says so and I beleive His word.

I'm a Christian, by the way.
   
  (#8 (permalink)) Old
Of Mike and Men Offline
Member
Experienced TeenHelper
******
 
Of Mike and Men's Avatar
 
Name: Michael
Age: 26
Gender: Male
Location: Texas

Posts: 543
Join Date: July 5th 2011

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 10th 2012, 04:06 PM

We can't prove anyone exists, much less G-D. We simply just trust things exist. The same way I trust you, whoever you are reading this, exist. Unless you can step out of your body to view things objectively, this thread is beating a dead horse with a stick.


It's amazing to me how many people think that voting to have the government give poor people money is compassion. Helping poor and suffering people yourself is compassion. Voting for our government to use guns to give money to help poor and suffering people is immoral, self-righteous, bullying laziness.
-Penn Jillette
   
  (#9 (permalink)) Old
Filling my panties with candy
I can't get enough
*********
 
MedusoidMycelium's Avatar
 
Age: 24
Gender: Female
Location: where ever the coffee is

Posts: 3,002
Join Date: January 6th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 11th 2012, 10:13 AM

I was christened as the church of england. But I don't believe in God. I don't there is a God. And before anyone lectures me on this heres why : When you think about it, people say we came from apes yet the bible says Adam and Eve were created and we are all from Adam and Eve. So by that theory we are all related. Not everyone is related to everyone.

I don't beleive there is a God. I beleive there is something out there, something greater, but not a God. I believe there is a heaven and hell - Heaven is the spirit realms, hell is here on earth - depending on whether or not we did good things whilst on earth we go to heaven or hell - if we were good we get to move between the spirit realms (heaven ) and earth realms (hell) . Those who were bad and did bad things stay trapped on earth realms (hell).

Religion is a controversial subject, you can challenge someones belief but you cannot always challenge the reasons behind someones belief because it is simply what they believe.

I believe in what believe in due to the fact I tend to look at things from a spiritulist point of view.

I do not believe in God - but I do believe there is something greater out there, just what that something greater is I don't know.



BADGER BADGER BADGER.........MUSHROOM!!!
Videos team
, articles team and helplink mentor and associate live help operator.
   
  (#10 (permalink)) Old
YOLO ♥ Offline
RoBsesseDirectioner <3
Senior TeenHelper
*******
 
YOLO ♥'s Avatar
 
Name: Manasvi (Mandy)
Age: 17
Gender: Girly Girl! ^_^ <3
Location: A hidden, faaaaar-off world where people love each other and everything is just perfect. :)

Posts: 778
Join Date: December 16th 2011

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 11th 2012, 03:30 PM

Well, now that's a debatable question!
Anyways, as users mentioned, no one can really prove anything. It's all about faith and belief of an individual. Possibly, IF God exists, there can be many names given to that supreme power, so it's actually not about proving the other one wrong.
But that's just my opinion, and NOT a fact or anything.

~Mandy xx


All we can do is Keep Breathing...!

   
  (#11 (permalink)) Old
YOLO ♥ Offline
RoBsesseDirectioner <3
Senior TeenHelper
*******
 
YOLO ♥'s Avatar
 
Name: Manasvi (Mandy)
Age: 17
Gender: Girly Girl! ^_^ <3
Location: A hidden, faaaaar-off world where people love each other and everything is just perfect. :)

Posts: 778
Join Date: December 16th 2011

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 11th 2012, 03:30 PM

Well, now that's a debatable question!
Anyways, as users mentioned, no one can really prove anything. It's all about faith and belief of an individual. Possibly, IF God exists, there can be many names given to that supreme power, so it's actually not about proving the other one wrong.
But that's just my opinion, and NOT a fact or anything.

~Mandy xx


All we can do is Keep Breathing...!

   
  (#12 (permalink)) Old
MadPoet Offline
You're the Original <3
Outside, huh?
**********
 
MadPoet's Avatar
 
Name: Amanda.
Age: 19
Gender: Female.
Location: Michigan.

Posts: 4,771
Join Date: January 8th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 11th 2012, 03:36 PM

I believe in the Christian God, but I don't claim to know for certain that he exists. I think there's an equal possibility that any other God exists, but I choose to believe in the Christian God, simply because I like the things the Christian God teaches, and it is what I feel comfortable with. I'm not the typical religious person, and I don't think anyone is more right than anyone else.





A lonely soul in a land of broken hearts


   
  (#13 (permalink)) Old
forfrosne Offline
I am immortal. So far so good.
I can't get enough
*********
 
forfrosne's Avatar
 
Name: Matthew
Age: 18
Gender: Male
Location: England

Posts: 3,382
Join Date: August 29th 2009

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 11th 2012, 08:36 PM

I think it's simply because the human mind can believe without evidence.

First:
The different Gods offer different things (perhaps you could think of them as competing products)
They cater to already existing opinions.

Disagree with contraception, homosexuality and like the ideas of Christianity? Roman Catholicism is for you!

The same can be said for each of the different Gods. There is nothing more 'mythical' about the Greek or Norse Gods than there is about the Christian, Hindu etc. Gods. Each offer a different path through life for a person to choose.

So, naturally, people will simply fall in line with the one that suits them best.

And how can they do this? My first point: they believe because they can. We Humans don't require proof of something to believe in it and therefore we simply choose to believe in things because we believe that the belief can add to our lives. For instance, I don't know that the Dalai Lama is a rebirth of a long line of tulku of Avalokiteśvara, but I can sure as hell believe it if I want to.

Further, you're basing your premise on an exclusivist view on religion. What if the ideas of Pluralism or Inclusivism are not correct? What if all religions (possibly even Atheism) are essentially different pathways to the same goal? I know many religious people who would believe this to be the case.

Belief in a higher God is not based on evidence in the first place, so the entire question in its phrasing is null.
   
  (#14 (permalink)) Old
LostAngels Offline
Glam Rocker/Classic Violinist
Average Joe
***
 
LostAngels's Avatar
 
Name: Jordan Lorraine
Gender: Female
Location: Calgary, Alberta

Posts: 103
Join Date: November 22nd 2011

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 20th 2012, 12:43 AM

One of my favorite quotes, that fits this thread quite well, although does not answer the question; addresses a good point:

"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours" - Stephen Roberts




"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours" - Stephen Roberts
   
  (#15 (permalink)) Old
Alto. Offline
We create the harmony.
Experienced TeenHelper
******
 
Alto.'s Avatar
 
Name: Erin/Eclipse
Age: 17
Gender: Female
Location: Rehearsal

Posts: 619
Join Date: April 1st 2010

Re: A (not so) quick question... - February 20th 2012, 04:31 AM

I'm Roman Catholic, do I believe in everything the Church teaches? Well, considering I'm a part of the LGBT community, no, I do not. This is a dumb answer, but I'm Catholic because I've been raised in a Catholic setting. I've always gone to Church on Sundays and Sunday school, now youth group. Another major reason I believe in the things I do is because of my grandmother, I may be biased, but she was one of the greatest person to ever live, and all who knew her are blessed. How she lived her life, her entire life, things she said and how she did the things she did, they were all in complete devotion to Christ and you would never know a more blessed person. I cannot prove that my God is real, or that any other God isn't, in my own personal opinion, not affiliated with the Church is that every greater being believed in, is a part of the same God. He is too amazing, too wonderful, too kind and loving to fit into only one religion.


life is too short to not be musical
   
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Tags
belief, disprove, faith, god, gods, question, quick, religion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All material copyright 1998-2014, TeenHelp.
Terms | Legal | Privacy | Conduct

Powered by vBulletin®.
Copyright ©2000-2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search engine optimization by vBSEO.
Theme developed in association with vBStyles.